Yes, 99, we have Disclosure......

First topic message reminder :

Ok, 99,

I think we can safely say that, in this past month, we have come close enough to Disclosure, for all practical purposes.  

You’re being the mathematician about Disclosure, and I’m being the physicist, and I’ve told this story a few times, already, but it won’t hurt to tell it again.......

A mathematician and a physicist walk into a bar, and sit on both sides of a very attractive woman.  The mathematician can only ever get halfway closer to the woman, but the physicist can get close enough for all practical purposes.  

Think of the physicist as Donald Trump, and think of the Boys on the Bus.  

Donald Trump will be known as the Disclosure President, for having helped to orchestrate what has transpired in the past month, not the least of which was chicken little realizing that, very likely, he was Visitor #1.  

Will any self respecting ufologist feel satisfied with this, Sonfish, version of Disclosure?  I would seriously doubt it.  However, will any competent historian ever come up with a better peg for Revelation?  I would seriously doubt it.  

.

wk,

Do you really think that the Multiverse hypothesis is supportive of the Interdimensional hypothesis?  

The MUH is used solely as a workaround to the Anthropic Principle...... in other words, it is being used to support materialism.  The Interdimensional hypothesis is the same as the portal hypothesis..... is for the purpose of puncturing materialism.  

Think of a portal as a bridge between different realms of consciousness....... different states of consciousness.  Dreams and death are such portals.  Each of the multiverses has its own Big Bang. Are we creating a Big Bang every time we dream?  This is absurd.

And, besides, virtually none of those other universes is inhabited.  

But, wk, if you want to continue your slumber of materialism, be my guest.  I just think you’re wasting your time in the BPW section.  


Yesterday, I gave lip service to smelly’s forray into existentialism....... life is an absurdity in a meaningless universe.  That was more than a little stretch for chicken little.  I guess I was trying to humor the goat.  

Existentialists are welcome to suppose their lives are meaningless.  That supposition affords them with a greater sense of freedom.  It certainly supports egocentrism..... if not solipsism..... a notion with which our goat friend is familiar.  

But what about the BPW......?

Do any of us have a choice?  Is there a veil behind which we choose our roles?  

In the BPW, every single role is integral/essential to Creation.  

What if one character were removed before their time?  

That is a nonsensical question.  It goes completely against the holistic/monistic grain of the BPW.  

This sounds like a great argument for the right to lifers.  Or, on the other side of the coin, is the BPWH providing license to commit murder and mayhem?  

It is impossible to do wrong in the BPW, try though we might.  

However, the guilt remains. Even smelly will feel the guilt, deny though he might....... unless, of course, smelly is a sociopath, which is not beyond the realm of possibility....... is it, smelly?



(cont.......)

GrandPa, I’ve been humoring you for 3 years.

You are free to judge the free, but you don’t know.

Don’t give me no lip potato chip.

You are free to go full evil, but you will still have a light in you.

You are free to go full good and you will have a spark of evil in you.

Would we want it any other way?!

NO!

You are not a very good existentialist.

Meaning is what you make your self.

No objective meaning or plan.

The narrative you keep fronting.

Yah, it’s bullshit.

How scornful of me to speak thusly!

Eek!!

Thus spoke Zarathustra.

ALL HAIL BOB

Slack on.

I wish I was a sociopath.

No guilt here possible muppet.

But I feel it all.

Every word.

How big is my heart?

I don’t know, if you prik me, I bleed.

You’re right, smelly........ I’m a horrible existentialist.

And, do keep in mind...... there is only one soul.  We only have to commit once to the entire shooting match.  

But even this much doesn’t really make any sense.  

This is where absurdity might enter our little equation of existence.  

The biggest little secret of the BPW is that no one ever really had a choice.  Our cosmic bootstrap is eternal.  

No one ever asked me if I wanted to be chicken little.  No one ever asked God if she wanted to be a Creator.  


9..........

There may be a yin/yang situation with regard to Creation...... we were always a gleam in the eye of the abyss, and the abyss is always a gleam in the eye of the pleroma.  One is the seed of the other.  The night sky represents the abyss.  

The BPW is the circle whose circumference is nowhere, and whose center is everywhere.  This is not unlike the Earth.  

Is this absurd?  

The only absurdity might be found in the lack of choice between nothing and everything........ and maybe the fact that we can never leave the stage.  We can never get off the merry go round.  The Buddhists can do this.......they cannot get back on.  


10:10.........

There need not be mystagoguery about any of this.  We know what we need to know, when we need to know it.  

We will partake of omniscience when we need to...... or really want to.  

Does this seem a little too claustrophobic? Perhaps....... but that can be fixed..... on the periphery.



(cont.......)

I wish I was a sociopath.~ smelly

Don't sell yourself short smelly, you're the best sociopath out there!

I try

A sociopath wouldn’t care to share their view.

They would just stick the knife in and smile as you die.

I would stick the knife in, but it would make me sad.

Those are human monsters

Even animals have feelings.

I’m a scornful existentialist this month.

I might be an Angel next month

Zen are often thought sociopaths.

Muppet ignorance about things they know not

The zen powered the Japanese.

It can go horribly wrong.

But the horrible leads to the beautiful and vice versa.

This is good UFO training.

I used to be interested in reading about great mountaineers and explorers and how their adventures, expeditions and journeys often involving their risking it all, resulted in their returning back changed. Evolved.

I think of lots of little pearls whether it be Hillary's leaving chocolate on Everest as an offering of thanks to the mountain. Sadly of late people leave her a mess

Ed Viesturs remarking in an interview that no one ever conquers a mountain, but that they are blessed if the mountain lets them pass.

Makes me ponder how some intrepid climbers, set out without maps, guides but with a burning fire inside of desire, a humble heart and above all faith.

Some others who follow on the journey, seek out guidance from those who previously took the journey and take the path left by those who came before, sometimes taking the same or similar path previously climbed, maybe even using the fixed ropes left behind.

Regardless of the path taken, its the journey not reaching the summit that changes us.

But what the hell do I know.

Nothing

Straight on

Sometimes you are the Buddha/Jesus/Cold Mountain

Sometimes you are a fool

Sometimes you speak

Sometimes you are ashes

Sometimes you think

Sometimes you play

Sometimes you are silent

Sometimes you are angry

Sometimes you feel emotions

Do you need a theory or philosophy to explain this?

No.

The desire for definition is delusion.

You are always a being here.

Being is not a fuck you to the world.

There is no teaching.

Or any students.

You are doing just fine CS.

Straight on.

...

"The Death of Certainty. Cultural relativism undermined the claims of absolute value systems, making all values situational. Neurophysiology negated the post-monotheist misconception of a unitary self, replacing it with a neo- pagan multimind model. Quantum physics negated causality, replacing it with a microcosm that runs on chaos and chance."

Written about the change of mind when the 19th century gave way to the 20th.

That must have been something.

Worlds colliding.

Familiar.

Thanks guys

I am actually heeding Ack's words of late...

Sometimes I read a little, sometimes not, sometimes watch videos, sometimes not, sometimes I get what seem to be interesting thoughts arriving from nowhere usually when I am tending to the needs of the four legged members of the family.

Are they relevant or is it the mind just playing games and passing through..

Who knows

I agree Smelly, we are here.. reflecting each other or maybe just talking to ourself

smelly,

Poor smelly, he confuses relativism with relationalism.  That’s ok, smelly.  We forgive you for having slept through Philosophy 101........ it can be very boring.  

However, if, by accident, smelly is right about relativism, then I’m not chicken little.  But, if he’s not, and if my being thrown under the Bus is mostly fake news, then I’m the Second Coming.......

That latter case would be a terrible, traumatic shock to smelly’s delicate system.  He might never recover.  The white coats might have to come and take him away.

But, no, if I were Jimmy the Greek, the odds would all favor smelly, and the white coats would be coming after chicken little.  smelly won’t have to worry.  

So don’t worry, smelly.  I hope you remember to send me a post card at the looney bin.  



(cont.......)

Loony bin?

Harry Reid happy to talk UFOs and science, not ‘little green men’

https://lasvegassun.com/news/2019/jun/29/harry-reid-happy-to-talk-ufos-and-science-not-litt/

Meanwhile ...

A small group of venture capitalists and technologists believe that humans can capture and reverse-engineer UFOs—and that trying to do so might be a good investment.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/597ebn/meet-silicon-valleys-ufo-hunters

dan wrote:smelly,

Poor smelly, he confuses relativism with relationalism.  That’s ok, smelly.  We forgive you for having slept through Philosophy 101........ it can be very boring.  

However, if, by accident, smelly is right about relativism, then I’m not chicken little.  But, if he’s not, and if my being thrown under the Bus is mostly fake news, then I’m the Second Coming.......

That latter case would be a terrible, traumatic shock to smelly’s delicate system.  He might never recover.  The white coats might have to come and take him away.

But, no, if I were Vegas Jack, the odds would all favor smelly, and the white coats would be coming after chicken little.  smelly won’t have to worry.  

Don’t worry, smelly.  I hope you remember to send me post cards at the looney bin.  



(cont.......)

Dan’s a moron, so nothing has much changed here.

Oh Dan, yuh still don’t realize, the harder you hold to your narrative, the bigger the fall.

It isn’t either/or, it’s more more more.

Who really gives two shits what he thinks about my experience of life?

I have consistently said let all be as they like and he just can’t abide the smelly goat.

Hey Dan, eat your eschaton heart out you miserable old person.

You are fairly clueless about how to live here.

You have to be God or the Antichrist or the second coming or the SoT.

I am just this.

Dan has had his mental health challenges I won’t iterate.

While the smelly goat just dropped some DMT and LSD.

Pick your poison, shock therapy or LSD.

I’d take the LSD man and relax.

You can play all you like of course and be anyone you like.

You have said near nothing about being here.

I don’t find any life in your words.

Just death.

Just thinking.

Your philosophies are ridiculous fantasies of mind.

Your missions are self deluded fantasies.

Buts that’s ok, cause we are all here and it simply doesn’t matter what any of us think about it.

Continue your fantastical ranting.

Oh please, pfffft.

We love you anyway.

It just doesn’t matter
It just doesn’t matter
It just doesn’t matter



Bahahahahahaha

Whatever you tell yourself about yourself is either a limit or the removal of such.

If you don’t tell yourself anything, then you can just be what the moment requires.

The kind of life I live and teams I want to be a part of, are ones where my buddy would go over the wall for me and I for them.

That capacity has given this life a lot of personal meaning.

It’s called integrity.

It’s hard to find.

It’s harder to live.

We all need an organizing principle.

Mine is here within my Self with the people around me.

That’s gotta be good enough in my life.

I don’t fucking care if the MIB and an alien knocked on the door.

Melt my brain?

It’s the hardest thing to go over that wall for another, for yourself, than anything else happening at that moment in the cosmos.

To ignore all your instincts and fear and just throw yourself into the breach.

That moment you say, screw it, I’m dead, but it’s got to be done.

Guess what your life is?

Going over that wall.

So if you think I’m here playing around with you Dan, just to mess with you, remember I’m here and always ready to go over that fucking wall.

If you think I maintain any delusions about my being, that’s your delusion, whatever helps you sleep at night.

This is the warrior heart, who also knows gentleness and joy in peace, but is always there on the wall watching.

We watch.

We act.

We do what needs doing.

Who are you old man here playing with things you don’t understand?

Would you die for me?

Would I die for you?

Would you die for this dream?

Why not?!

Let’s do it, let’s go all the way!

If we aren’t at that level together, we aren’t human beings and we are just wasting time and I’d say that’s pretty personal.

Does anyone ever deserve for another to go over that wall?

Deserve doesn’t come into it.

Have I risked my life and sanity on OMF?

Have I given it all on the field?

Not yet.

I entered this arena to do battle.

Battle with my self and God.

I sought out the edge of knowing to give being meaning.

I found nothing but lies and liars, myself chief among them.

Arjuna is restless and paces back and forth with his bloody sword.

Come out then and let’s finish it!

What is it Lord Krishna requires?!

He can take my head any moment.

So it’s something else.

Perhaps he likes his pets.

And perhaps he likes them viscous, ravenous even.

Well, I throw my sword down and say, enough killing.

I’ll die for them, not kill them.

That’s my choice.

Arjuna is done fighting.

And so God died and where he died, flowers grow forever.

“Arjuna is the voice of the seeker. His is the voice of our humanity. His voice is our voice as we reach out for Divine support and guidance. He is the embodiment of our strength, our valor, our worldly skill, our bravery. He is also the embodiment of our frailty as human beings. He gives a voice to our confusion, to our ignorance. He also gives a voice to our devotion and our willingness to learn, grow, and transform.”

If I feel kin to any in history is to this mythic dude Arjuna and his struggle with Krishna. I do not compare to his virtue and valor nor claim to be wise, but surely I am living out that play with Dan.

Surely I have given voice to my/our confusion and ignorance.

It seems that smelly is inviting me to play Krishna......

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna,
Krishna Krishna Hare Hare,
Hare Rama Hare Rama,
Rama Rama Hare Hare

According to Wikipedia on the Gita.......

One must do the right thing because one has determined that it is right, states Gita, without craving for its fruits, without worrying about the results, loss or gain.

I’m doubtful that smelly would approve.  

According to Winthrop Sargeant, the text acknowledges that some individuals are more reflective and intellectual, some affective and engaged by their emotions, some are action driven, yet others favor experimenting and exploring what works.[82] It then presents different spiritual paths for each personality type respectively.....

It seems that the Gita is considerably more tolerant than is smelly...... just sayin....

According to Galvin Flood and Charles Martin, the Gita rejects the shramanic path of non-action, emphasizing instead "the renunciation of the fruits of action"

The Bhagavad Gita, states Raju, is a great synthesis of the ideas of the impersonal spiritual monism with personal God, of "the yoga of action with the yoga of transcendence of action, and these again with yogas of devotion and knowledge".

Obviously, Krishna is a good role for me.  Krishna is much more open minded than is our goat.  


8:40........

smelly is very rigid with his no thought, no action strictures.



(cont......)

I fart in your general direction.



You have restated my disagreement with Krishna.

Why the draw to Zen and Taoism?

Because they are human beings not writing holy books. I burn holy books and I roast holy men. There are no such things as holy books or holy men. No one speaks for God, we all together are god speaking. They don’t have prophets. They don’t have any gods. They don’t think of their relation to nature in terms of higharchy or fear or how to dominate it.

They suffered and found a way.

We can easily romanticize what is novel or foreign, it isn’t that.

I was taken by their poetry first.

If you have no art or poetry I don’t know how you are human.

Just minds filled with thoughts.

Even writing this, I’m not thinking, which might be obvious

The words just come.

We are not our thoughts or memory.

They happen.

These people have answered how then shall they live?

This is all I speak about.

This is the only question I ask.

This is not an anti-intellectual or anti-religious perspective.

It is thinking just enough.

It is learning to apply the right amount of pressure and learning to pull back when needed.

It is about learning to surface your emotions so they don’t bubble.

It is not a rejection of my western upbringing.

It is not an embrace of nihilism, nor is it solipsism.

The context for life is where you are.

We are very confused in the West.

We look to the skies and fight our neighbors and covet the good life.

While our eastern friends have looked into themselves.

This is valuable to my life in that it is helped me to learn to accept what is here and who I am here.

And then the poetry began to come from me.

It’s a special thing no one but the one expressing it can feel.

Anyway, Dan, your characterizations are absolutely ridiculous.

You are a silly ole distracted fool.

Dan wrote:WHAT ATHIESTS SAY ABOUT RELIGION

Some of the best writing I’ve read about religion has come from people opposed to it. They have to ground their arguments in reason, and often, their analysis is pretty good.

This passage caught my eye: “If you look at all the Eastern religions — think Hinduism, New Age, Taoism, Jainism, these sorts of things — all their alleged holy books, whether it’s the Vedas or Upanishads or Bhagavad Gita or whatever these might be — those are just people’s suggestions about what they think might be religious. Oh, I think this, or I think that, or these ancient sages said this. But none of that comes with the authority of their God.” The writer contrasts that to Christians who declare that the Bible is the word of God and that makes their truth divine.

I like that the Taoist texts were written by people. I want to know that the authors had to go through life as it applies to me, not a god. I want to know that those writers had foibles, grief, frustration, and illness—and yet turned that into art. I want to know that they saw gruesome death and terrible disasters. And knowing all that, I value their words when they say this is a life of joy, divinity, and hope.

Words that come from a source that never had to face the conflicts of being human might seem like a good recommendation. But it won’t carry the same weight as a fragile, fallible, and struggling human being who steadfastly urges us to reach for the spiritual.

________

https://friendlyatheist.patheos.com/2019/06/21/creationist-the-bible-is-true-because-god-says-the-bible-is-true-2

The above written by a Taoist.

I don’t have a definition for spiritual.

Some inner sense happens.

Frank Tipler has a theory, it’s all managed by physics.

The spiritual has a place in his science, which are the forms that are not material.

I don’t know about anything beyond my life.

I wouldn’t comment or speculate about the future.

I don’t need to know the future.

The future is always here.

That’s pretty good for a country boy from VA.