Immaterialism 6

First topic message reminder :

First topic message reminder :

This is the continuation of the Immaterialism 5 thread.......

The original topic reminder post https://openmindsforum.forumotion.com/t320-immaterialism
should be substituted here......

Please remember to confine you dialogue to matters that are pertinent to the topic of immaterialism/disclosure.  

Thank you.  

............

Thank you for your patience, smelly........

With Aaron’s help, I’m beginning to get a handle on my blind spot, here.  

With my western, Parmenidian, take on being and monism, I was making the same mistake that Newton made in his absolutizing of space and time.  

smelly was just trying to Zen slap me.

But I have pretty thick skin...... but, brother, am I ever a sucker for words......


(cont......)

What?!

WTF did Dan just say?

No no no

Let me clear my ears out.

Ha

I’ve been here 3 years saying the same thing and I’d say I’ve been very patient.

We don’t have to agree ever, but it is funny what you say.

I’ve put up with constant pretenders and muppets with their stupid limited vision

That was the fun part actually.

Every time I slapped you I only heard the BPW and history and Jesus blah blah blah you are nihilist and evil, blah blah blah.

You are faking, trying to make me go away.

Haha.

smelly,

See, you finally managed to Zen slap me with your words.  

You just have to be patient with us muppets.

But, watch out, when the Logos finally gets non being in sights, all hell might break loose.  

Then we’ll all have to run for cover.

Rebalancing, as Aaron reminds us, of this non magnitude, can be just a little bit tricky.



(cont.......)

This is the way Dan.

I just Zen it know to my bone marrow.

Zen is not the end all be all, but the core of it is like nothing else on earth.

The best humanity has got.

Radical acceptance living in our own Being,

Perfectly imperfect.

Ok, you shut me up.

Hmmm........ is smelly also jumping to conclusions?

Do you really think that you have flushed the j-guy down the drain?

Maybe we should all take a deep breath, and think again.......

Or no-think again, as the case might be.......



(cont.......)

Wow

Dan just said take a deep breath and not think....

Haha

I love it!

I don’t have anything else to say here Dan.

I think you got me

The energy is dissipating now.

I feel it ebbing back into the stream.

I don’t know who to thank, but I feel Being knows it self here.

I can tell you friends, even when the whole world stands against you, hold your line when you know it was all for you, all the teaching was for you, this is how we keep Jesus and Buddha and Lao and all the others alive here.

Back to my little hut by the mountain...

Yes, it would be nice to stop and savor the moment........

Whose woods these are I think I know.
His house is in the village though;
He will not see me stopping here
To watch his woods fill up with snow.

My little horse must think it queer
To stop without a farmhouse near
Between the woods and frozen lake
The darkest evening of the year.

He gives his harness bells a shake
To ask if there is some mistake.
The only other sound’s the sweep
Of easy wind and downy flake.

The woods are lovely, dark, and deep.
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep.

Maybe bobby was not as dumb as he looked.  

I do think that a new take on non-being might help to better explain the Quantum and free will.

We can’t really appreciate non-being without grasping the fullness of being..... a la Parmenides and Plotinus. Possibly, our Zen brothers could have used a bit more of Parmenides.



(cont.......)

I told Dan last night that the SoT role really isn't for me....that I'm more of a heart guy than a head guy

I can see how both logos and emptiness are really two sides of the same coin....the prickly and gooey as Alan Watts would say.

I dont know what is happening.

Don't need to know really.

Nothing appearing as everything.

Straight on

Aaron,

It may be non-being that makes headroom for the heart.

Where is Max Headroom when we need him? Maybe he got a room with Rumi.

Yes, it may be non-being that makes headroom or the heart.

A very selfless thing for source to provide headroom for us Muppets.

Ok, just tying things off here,



If you make a connection between Heidegger and the Eastern mind, you can have a radical awakening and level reset.

You can’t avoid existentialism or your breath.

If you wade into the Mandelbrot set you will be radically transformed.

The objectification of the world happened.

Now we return.

I have spoken of living an authentic life.

To live an authentic life, you hear and follow your own being.

Not mass humanity.

Here we can see a function of alienation.

The Outsider is strangely attracted to existentialism.

The beats are the soul behind the hippie.

The ultimate outsiders.

We face our own death.

Embrace it even.

We don’t look at it as just the end of our biology.

But the finitude of human existence.

In the acute crisis, the end of our persona, we face history.

Even the authentic person must consider themselves in history and the possibilities given to us.

We appropriate a dynamic history and revitalize it.

We don’t have a static inherited tradition in history.

We have to make ourselves.

This is the process of individuation.

We each inherit all of history in our time.

This is true for the first time ever in our time biologically.

Why now?

Science has shattered cultural meaning and they are all mixing and reacting to this.

There are those who try to hold onto the past as golden age.

There are those who see history critically and see it a story of our will to power, Marxist post-modern view.

Monumental history is about appropriating great events and persons who inspire future evolution.

We have to be deeply rooted in our history to evolve.

History provides inspiration for discovery.

We can ground ourselves in a tradition, but this is no longer needed.

Transcendence is what Zen and existentialism hint at.

It requires an encounter with your total destruction is all.

The wanderer becomes all things as needed in whatever age they wander through.

I see our purpose alive is to dig up the gems from the past using the future.

We sew the ground with shit and the seeds of history and the ancient flowers still grow.



“Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Heres Tom with the Weather.”

—Bill Hicks

What a trip dudes floating down this river of love.

Har har

Bill Hicks’ Death Essay below, I thought it appropriate...I echo his heart, with a squishy view of truth and untruth. He died at 32 at the height of his powers, pancreatic cancer to liver cancer.

I feel I may die this way as well. I have pancreatic liver issues. Be fun I’m sure when my ticket is punched. The pain killers are going to rock!

...

I was born William Melvin Hicks on December 16, 1961 in Valdosta, Georgia. Ugh. Melvin Hicks from Georgia. Yee Har! I already had gotten off to life on the wrong foot. I was always "awake," I guess you'd say. Some part of me clamoring for new insights and new ways to make the world a better place. All of this came out years down the line, in my multitude of creative interests that are the tools I now bring to the Party. Writing, acting, music, comedy. A deep love of literature and books. Thank God for all the artists who've helped me. I'd read these words and off I went – dreaming my own imaginative dreams. Exercising them at will, eventually to form bands, comedy, more bands, movies, anything creative. This is the coin of the realm I use in my words – Vision. On June 16, 1993 I was diagnosed with having "liver cancer that had spread from the pancreas." One of life's weirdest and worst jokes imaginable. I'd been making such progress recently in my attitude, my career and realizing my dreams that it just stood me on my head for a while. "Why me!?" I would cry out, and "Why now!?" Well, I know now there may never be any answers to those particular questions, but maybe in telling a little about myself, we can find some other answers to other questions. That might help our way down our own particular paths, towards realizing my dream of New Hope and New Happiness. Amen. I left in love, in laughter, and in truth and wherever truth, love and laughter abide, I am there in spirit.

Don’t forget Bill.

Ha

The Dude Abides!

Reading this forum feels like Punch and Judy show.


Hobbit

Remember Bill

I believe Tool wrote this song in remembrance of Bill.

He was one of my favorite said sacred clowns...

smelly,

Nice one with Reza.........

And I’m only four minutes in........

Eulogy lyrics:

"He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
We're gonna miss him
We're gonna miss him
So long
We wish you well
You told us how you weren't afraid to die
Well, so long
Don't cry
Or feel too down
Not all martyrs see divinity
But at least you tried
Standing above the crowd
He had a voice that was strong and loud
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
Ranting and pointing his finger
At everything but his heart
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
We're gonna miss him
We're gonna miss him
No way to recall
What it was that you had said to me?
Like I care at all
But it was so loud
You sure could yell
You took a stand on every little thing
And so loud
You could be the one who saves me from my own existence
Warn while some child might chill, nine-one-two
I'm too smart when you're invisible by the bone symbol on you
So he bashes his skull through the window while looking out to the sea
Like torment of my ego
And we're amused by this
Yeah, standing above the crowd
He had a voice that was strong and loud and I
Swallowed his facade 'cause I'm so
Eager to identify with
Someone above the ground
Someone who seemed to feel the same
Someone prepared to lead the way
And someone who would die for me
Will you?
Will you now?
Would you die for me?
Don't you fuckin' lie
Don't you step out of line
Don't you step out of line
Don't you step out of line
Don't you fuckin' lie
You've claimed all this time that you would die for me
Why then are you so surprised when you hear your own eulogy?
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
Come down
Get off your fucking cross
We need the fuckinh space to nail the next fool martyr
To ascend you must die
You must be crucified
For our sins and our lies
Goodbye"

Smelly,

Bill will never be forgotten

I guess Carlin also sits with him somewhere. I bet the show is something to behold..

"It just is and so are we for a little while"

hobbit wrote:

Reading this forum feels like Punch and Judy show.


Hobbit

Then perhaps we are closer to the truth/untruth of things.

Carlin was another Punch, a sacred clown.

As is Bill Murray.

I imagine they have a sense of their role on earth more than most.

We few freaks are born seeing.

We like to crowd around
Those who float off the ground
In hopes we too may learn
What it is to ever burn
The world is not fixed
It is an ever changing sea of cliques
All things that rise must fall
Only then can we stand tall

Aaron wrote:Eulogy lyrics:

"He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
We're gonna miss him
We're gonna miss him
So long
We wish you well
You told us how you weren't afraid to die
Well, so long
Don't cry
Or feel too down
Not all martyrs see divinity
But at least you tried
Standing above the crowd
He had a voice that was strong and loud
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
Ranting and pointing his finger
At everything but his heart
We'll miss him
We'll miss him
We're gonna miss him
We're gonna miss him
No way to recall
What it was that you had said to me?
Like I care at all
But it was so loud
You sure could yell
You took a stand on every little thing
And so loud
You could be the one who saves me from my own existence
Warn while some child might chill, nine-one-two
I'm too smart when you're invisible by the bone symbol on you
So he bashes his skull through the window while looking out to the sea
Like torment of my ego
And we're amused by this
Yeah, standing above the crowd
He had a voice that was strong and loud and I
Swallowed his facade 'cause I'm so
Eager to identify with
Someone above the ground
Someone who seemed to feel the same
Someone prepared to lead the way
And someone who would die for me
Will you?
Will you now?
Would you die for me?
Don't you fuckin' lie
Don't you step out of line
Don't you step out of line
Don't you step out of line
Don't you fuckin' lie
You've claimed all this time that you would die for me
Why then are you so surprised when you hear your own eulogy?
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
He had a lot to say
He had a lot of nothing to say
Come down
Get off your fucking cross
We need the fuckinh space to nail the next fool martyr
To ascend you must die
You must be crucified
For our sins and our lies
Goodbye"

Wow

Reza, at seven minutes, is talking about the breakdown of our bicameral mind, when he speaks about the breakdown or objectification of the world that took place in the Renaissance.

This is the Heideggerian analysis of history.

Jaynes had this breakdown occurring in the Mediterranean, at the time of Thera, 1500BC.



(cont.......)