Immaterialism 6

First topic message reminder :

First topic message reminder :

This is the continuation of the Immaterialism 5 thread.......

The original topic reminder post https://openmindsforum.forumotion.com/t320-immaterialism
should be substituted here......

Please remember to confine you dialogue to matters that are pertinent to the topic of immaterialism/disclosure.  

Thank you.  

............

whoknows wrote:

smelly wrote:

whoknows wrote:

smelly wrote:you nor anyone has an ego

Haha

Yeah wow. you really had me fooled.

There are no such things as egos.

Your judgments are your own.

You are full of them apparently leaky muppet.

Now that a judgment of a different color if I've ever seen one.

Seem to see them quit frequently around here.

Ooops there it is in my judgment identifier book.  

Fly away leaky bird, nothing for you here.

LOL careful smelly your ego is showing.

I can always tell, cuz you start making adolescent comments... you're so easy to wind up.

Big Huggs smelly goat

You are amusing in your confusion.

I love how you are constantly wound up.

What a fun leaky hippie.

This is a whoknows therapy session.

Do you need a hug?

**Hug**

Yes thank you smelly... I feel much better now.

I don’t think anything is ever gonna make you feel better.

There is a deep sadness and bitterness in you.

But I have been patient with you.

You can always have a hug.

Relax maybe and enjoy the show.

LOL you don't get me at all.

smelly wrote:There is a deep sadness and bitterness in you.

When make silly comments like that. I have to go back to my old adolescent stand by.

When you point fingers and make judgments like that you have three pointing back at you.

Here's another, "Check yourself first."

whoknows wrote:LOL you don't get me at all.

smelly wrote:There is a deep sadness and bitterness in you.

When make silly comments like that. I have to go back to my old adolescent stand by.

When you point fingers and make judgments like that you have three pointing back at you.

Here's another, "Check yourself first."  

Ohhhhh

We touched the raw nerve.

I feel you leaky muppet.

I’m always here for you.

Punch away.

Much love as you like to say.

Relax and drink your Metamucil.

Shhhhhhhhhhhh now

It’s all gonna be ok big boy.

I enjoy these morning whoknows therapy sessions.

But they are off topic.

Apologies Dan.

Sighs, you'll get it one of these days,

I do love you smelly. But then I love Hitler too. difference is, I don't like what Hitler did or the way he acted towards others, but I've always liked you.

Oh now the clueless one knows who has IT or not.

Bahahahahahahaha

You are perfect as you are whoknows.

Turn about's fair play smelly, you're the one that's normally is telling everyone how wrong they are.

Wrong as always, so full of judgment you are, Delicious.

You don’t get the joke, so it’s on you.

Change your leaky hippie diaper.

We sell them on isle 5.

Made you grumpy today old one, you have to change them when they are wet.

Remind your visiting angel.

Here’s hoping, if you even wake up tomorrow, that your tomorrow is a joyful one.

smelly would make a really good Walmart greeter.  He missed his calling.  


I’m studying ‘nothing’, in Wikipedia and the SEP.......

Western philosophy abhors nothingness, as it does chaos and the unbounded..... the apeiron.  

It’s presence is felt most strongly in the domain of the quantum.  

But then I have to take that back......

The early Greeks, such as Anaximander practically deified the Apeiron.

Here we may equate nothingness with the indefinite or the unobservable.

It was the notion of observation in quantum physics, which reified the concept of the unobservable..... and at the same time, bringing subjectivity to ontology in unmistakable fashion.



(cont......)

Dan, just a thought here, what if you sought nothing inside your self?

Last I checked it wasn’t found in any book or website.

Whoknows has a whole lot of nothing going on.

You could also ask him

smelly,

Ok, the self is the source of nothingness, along with everything else...... just as nothingness must be the Source of Self.  That what the early Greeks discovered..... Anaximander , especially.  

I have often said that the primordial monadic Source must’ve bootstrapped itself out of the void or total chaos.

There cannot be a pure nothing, because nothing always contains the potential for something.

But once we obtained the something, it was too easy to kick nothingness aside..... throw it on the ash heap.  

Clearly, it must continue to play a vital role in its juxtaposition with the something.  

A portal would be a concrescence of nothingness.... a collective blind spot. Of course, Whitehead would speak of misplaced concreteness.



(cont......)

I don’t know if this is helpful to you, but it continues my Heidegger flow.

“Unconcealment and concealment, therefore, are fundamental characteristics of this transmetaphysical ground, and the problem with metaphysics is not only that it has failed to deal with unconcealment, but that it has dismissed the problem of concealment entirely. As Heidegger explains, "metaphysics never pays attention to what has concealed itself in this very on [beings] insofar as it has been unconcealed."

Nonbeing, however, is not necessarily negativity as such and cannot be equated with negation or negativity in the finite sense. Nonbeing, because of its ontological status, is prior to negativity. As Heidegger maintains, "Nothing is more original than the 'not' and 'negation.'" Nonbeing cannot be thought of as negativity in the finite sense because, though it certainly is the concealment of Being, it never negates Being. Being can never be negated, only concealed; for Being, even in its concealment, always "is." This is why Heidegger, in his discussion of Nonbeing, does not refer to it as the negation of Being but only as the "veil" of Being. The very nature of Being, then, is one of self-concealment. It gives birth to beings -- in the sense that it is the source of beings -- but in giving birth, it does not itself become a being.”

Yes, okay, that’s what I was struggling to say......

What can be the ground of being, other than some sort of nonbeing?  

Heidegger refers to non being as the veil of being.  

This is another way of saying that potentiality is the veil of all being.  

The Void is just the womb of Being.

But we don’t spring from that Womb fully clothed.

No.  We must contain, at the core of our being, a retarded remnant of that non being. It is what greases the wheels of our thought.

Along with the cosmic glue, we need this cosmic grease.  

But why do we need grease for the BPW?

The BPW might be considered a block/rigid world...... how can you modify perfection?  How can you mess with success?  

How flows the vital force...... how do we account for the smellys?  

There is that quantum fuzziness, which is so vital to the world.

It is that fuzziness which, ironically, allows matter to be stable.

As an Immaterialist, I take my quantum with a big grain of salt.

It’s the quantum logic that I take seriously.

This is the logic of to be or not to be.



(cont......)

There is a fellow in time I resonate with greatly, his name is Joshu.

He had nothing to teach and that was what he said.

The world and living is its own reward, there is nothing good or bad in it, Holy or unholy, the world is nothing beyond itself.

What is is right here "right in front of the eyes": it is "the oak tree in the front garden"; "the leg of the chair"; "the scorched kettle...."

Our minds are trained to respond to things in terms of diferentiation and identification. Underlying such mental processes is the universal prejudice that beyond the mere existence of things there is "an essence," beyond their appearance "a meaning." Yet once we realize that the existence of things is their essence (their appearance, their meaning), what is there to understand?

In our quest for "meaning" we have tried almost every possible answer except the most simple and obvious one: that the meaning of things are the things themselves. Everything is, inasfar as it cannot be denied. However, its raison d'etre does not lie in any other thing nor in some principle or truth beyond the thing itself. The essence of a thing is no-thing or nothing.

When Joshu met a monk, he would spit in his face first.

A message there is nothing to learn.

I save my spit for morons like whoknows.

Funny Zen masters.

But I feel them.

One doesn’t need to accept nothing to learn.

What does the world as it appears mean to you?

That can only be answered by each person in the context of their own life I feel.

I’ve never been able to determine if portals really appear in your reality.

That’s metaphorical to me.

But if lights shut off our nuclear weapons is that not the meaning?

Is not seeing lights play with us the obvious meaning?

If a portal can be located that moves our observation to a hive structure.

Isn’t the meaning obvious?

Joshu = Zhaozhou (778 - 897)

He lived to a venerable age.

One of his books was the Gateless Gate, which might be another term for portal.

Zen is an admirable attempt to contain, to point to the uncontainable.  

It may well be the best possible attempt.  

The Quantum and the Zen clearly belong to the same lineage.  

Yes, we struggle to contain the uncontainable. Civilization is about keeping chaos on a short leash. That is the function of democracy.... keeping chaos in bounds. Chaos is essential to the maintenance of civilization.... and the Self. It is a tricky balancing act, as we see with all the wannabe autocrats around the world.


(cont......)

You now might know where I am coming from.

Yah, I’ve strong armed you all this time ZhouZhou style

I’ve spit in your faces as liars and fools knowing there is nothing to teach and learn.

I’ve been a right pest reminding my self of this out loud here.

Tell me then, besides my own experience, who knows it better than what I’ve uncovered?

Did I not go right to the source of my life?

I realized I have only found nothing, limitless potential, bounded in my life.

But history and culture and genes and environment and perhaps forces we are not aware of individually, guide our lives.

We can’t let any of what we are go really.

The meaning is not the measure of the object for me.

We can’t ever really be born or die.

What we think and feel are part of us too.

And it all leads to what we do.

What did I miss?

I’m listening.

Smelly has missed nothing

Dan is the philosophy king

Ring a ding ding

Now all of us can sing

I spent a lot of time with Aaron too

For no reason or point

I was amused

Fine, let him take all of it

So I coughed it all up

I offered my self wholly to any who wanted to converse and I let it fly

I have no idea what has happened or not here

I did what I felt to do

I had fun

Had we listened to the Zen masters all along, we would not be in the predicament that we are today.  

Ours must be the best possible predicament, we just have to figure out how.  

We are all dressed up, now, particularly with our internet.  We just don’t know what our clothes are for.  

Some of us.... most of us are waiting for Godot, or some such Singularity or Revelation.  

We slouch toward Bethlehem....... have mercy on our souls.

Heidegger then is exactly right isn’t he?

We have chucked away no-thing as if we ever could have.

Humanism looms over us like a tower about to fall.

Just occilations in eternity.

And now we face the piper for being so silly.

When monkeys get together to do things they make civilization and atom bombs and Shakespeare, all fighting for our soul.

The bad news is that flying saucers are a piece of nothingness.  

The good news is that they are the royal road to our unconscious.

Yes, they are flying pieces of our collective unconscious....... come here to rub our noses in our own unconscious.  

Kant speaks of the noumenon...... the unknowable..... the untouchable.  

Well, the unknowable has to be knowable, in the End.  

That’s the way the Quantum works.  The only thing unobservable is the Nothing.  Now the Nothing comes home to roost.  

We are fish swimming in our collective unconscious.  

We can’t observe the water until it changes phase on us.

We sweep everything under that rug...... and then we lift a corner of the rug.  We find everything we’d forgotten..... the Akashic record in the sky.

The MoAPS is the cosmic phase change.  A portal is the steam bubble forming at the bottom of the pan.  The heat is turning up, the water is coming to a boil..... there are portals/bubbles everywhere.  

Portals are about seeing the microcosm in everything.  That’s what smelly and the Princess did with Aaron...... months at a time.

That’s what Sophia did with me, back in ‘77...... in about ten minutes.... slam, bam, thank you, ma’am.  

Then I could be a stranger in a strange land...... like seeing things for the first time.  The scales come off the eyes.  You can’t go back.  You don’t even think of it.  

9/11 and Vegas are blips on that radar...... lost in muppet land..... lost in translation.  

Brazil is Lais to me.  Everything else was a blur, as it was for Joe Queso....... a blur he would rather forget.  

I could go on..... and I will, but you get the idea. smelly and Aaron get it, with the help of Princess, between them.

But now what?

We wait for Godot.....?

We wait for the spider of entanglement...... to do it’s work..... to cast its net...... and we already have the internet.... casting its spell...... doing its not so subtle work.

We’ll see......


(cont.......)

There is a difference between nothing and no-thing.

A thing relative to the dimension We and this planet are is in 3D.

Consciousness is what enables things to be, or not to be in 3D.

The presence of consciousness in a dual helical vortex locally enables 3D.

It is the entanglement of consciousness that thus is the father/son relationship.

Consciousness is in 4D.

You are enabled to be within Your own local dual helical vortex of consciousness, as is the planet.

When that dual local vortex ceases You will be termed as dead.
For a while Your vehicle will appear to be solid, until the planets consciousness permeates Your vehicle to become the planet.

The reason it will appear to go solid (rigor) is due to universe been the perfectly packed solid , with the faces of the packing been the reside of dimensions.

Your eternal resides in 5D which in Your vehicle is in Your heart.

Hobbit