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Mind Mix Radio hosted by Manticore Group joins the Open Minds Forum May of 2016. Featuring talk on a wide variety of subjects ranging from research to current events, it is expected to add a new dimension to the materials featured at OMF.


The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

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ScaRZ
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The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:05 am

First topic message reminder :

Hello everyone, I've decided to give Part 3 a go if Bren doesn't care. I just hope OM can attract some of the old members as well as some new members.

The first thing I want to post in the Part 3 Thread are some links of the late David Flynn's work. David's work has been some of my favorite for many years. I never knew David personally but was a member at a couple of his forums. I got interested in his work back a long time ago after visiting his Watcher Web Site.

David's twin brother Mark did drop by OMF a few years back and did post a thank you post in The Bible,UFOs,ET and the Ancients Thread for posting some of David's work....."I believe it was one of David's videos."

David died This year and I really believe he left behind a great deal of material that is for us today and on into the future. I just hope one day I will come to the point of understanding in depth a great amount of his work.

This is a series at http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/ and I will continue to post the parts as they come out. I will only post a snippet of each part, so be sure and click on the links for the full articles.


Part 1 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-one.htm

Remembering David Flynn

A new series on the research and findings of a modern Christian genius

by Thomas Horn


"This is the first entry into a series on the works and discoveries of David Eric Flynn, a modern Christian genius who died at the age of 49 this past January 22, 2012 after a short battle with cancer. For nearly two decades David published original and groundbreaking research on his renowned Watchers Website."

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Part 2 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-two.htm


A Note from Steven Quayle


"David Flynn, like Isaac Newton before him, was a “GIANT” in the understanding of the God of Creations’ infinite majesty, power, and presence throughout the universe displayed. Every generation has its heaven-sent “Time-Keepers” to remind the world that we all have an appointed time and season of revelation and purpose to all that we see around us. It is as if the Almighty God holds specific time locks to His revelations and specific messengers tasked with bringing it forth."

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Part 3 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-three.htm

Notes from Mark Flynn


"One of our high school history teachers brought in a retired Air Force officer who gave a talk about incidents that occurred in 1967 and 1975 where entire “flights” of Minuteman ICBMs were simultaneously and inexplicably shut down immediately after UFOs were sighted in the vicinity of Malmstrom Air force base."

"In addition to the stories that we heard about the goings on around Great Falls, our dad told us a story that he had heard from Dr. Jesse Marcel Jr. while they happened to be working at the same hospital. When Jesse was a kid, his dad came home very late one night and woke everybody up to show them some parts that he had gathered from the site of a crashed spaceship."

"Dad related the story to us in a very matter-of-fact style. Nothing suggested that Jesse’s account might have been an exaggeration or just a story. It was just two colleagues, Dr. Flynn and Dr. Marcel, having a conversation."

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Part 4 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-four.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"The Jewish sages explained that Cain built the first city and therefore was the founder of civilization. Cain named this city Enoch after his first son (Genesis 4:16–17). Also according to the sages, the names of Enoch’s grandson and great grandson, Mehujael and Methusael (man smitten by Elohim and man who is of Elohim) shows that for a time the knowledge of Elohim, the name of God recorded in Genesis, was preserved, but soon disappeared. Their reasoning was that the lineage of Cain had died in the flood. However, the human race survived through Noah and his family descended from Seth, Adam’s third son. The Mystics focused on the two Enochs that lived before the great deluge of Noah. The first, the son of Cain, had transferred the sacred knowledge from Eden into the first civilization that was later destroyed due to its corruption and evil. The second Enoch, from the line of Seth, preserved the pure knowledge apart from this corruption. This body of knowledge had been incorporated in ancient structures geometrically. Its decipherment needed a key thought to exist in a universal language that was lost. Ironically, the event that caused its loss corresponded with the development of writing and the birth of civilization. Although biblical chronology renders it impossible for Noah to have met Enoch from the line of Seth, he would have known Methuselah, Enoch’s son. Methuselah lived for 967 years. There was a belief among biblical scholars that Noah would have possessed the learning of Enoch, particularly because it had been recorded in writing."

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Part 5 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-five.htm

From the works of David Flynn


"Newton devoted his entire life in the quest of a pure science and theology. If he had discovered the prisca sapientia, and further evidence will show that he did, he would not have resorted to leaving such a discovery in the hands of the unworthy. It is likely a unifying theory of the laws of creation with the laws of God would be best suited to a code. This form of writing and encryption, in Newton’s reasoning, was the modality in which the Bible itself had been written. As God revealed the Law of Moses to men with supernatural power, and its words revered and protected, a unifying law of creation should be presented in like manner. Similarly, the dispensation to men of such a powerful truth would only take place with the full intent and providence of God; Newton , however, would not write of its discovery openly. He would seal it within his papers exploring the laws and the creation of God. These vast works, ranging from chronology, natural philosophy, and theology suggested its presence, visible only to those given the eyes to see."

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Part 6 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-six.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"For Newton , every theoretical revelation that he achieved stood as verification of Daniel’s prophecy as reads in Dan12:4: “Even to the time of the end…knowledge shall be increased.” Newton viewed the book of Daniel as a missive extending through time to him, addressed to his intellect, a mind divinely inspired to value and solve its riddles."

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Part 7 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-seven.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"For as the few and obscure Prophecies concerning Christ’s first coming were for setting up the Christian religion, many and clear Prophecies concerning the things to be done at Christ’s second coming are not only for predicting, but also for effecting a recovery and re-establishment of the long-lost truth." —Issac Newton, Observations upon the Prophecies of Daniel and the Apocalypse of St. John

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Part 8 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-eight.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"Many scholars—even before Newton—believed that the geometry of the future temple of Jerusalem and the “heavenly city of Jerusalem” of Revelation possessed some key to the unfolding of prophecy itself. God as a “divine geometer” pervaded early Christian thought. This was the belief that both the natural creation and architecture of the temple were from the same designer. The temple was, then, a microcosm of the universe in which God’s structure of time was represented both symbolically and geometrically. The Bible records that the Israelites constructed of two temples, the first built by Solomon and the second by Zerubbabel. In Revelation, Daniel and John mention a third future temple existing at the second coming of Christ. Some theologians believe that Ezekiel described this third temple in chapter 40 through the end of his book. Still others contend that Ezekiel’s temple is in fact a fourth temple that will be built after the great cataclysms described in Revelation. However, theologians are in agreement that Ezekiel’s temple is designated for the 1,000 years of peace after the return of Christ, termed the “millennium” in Christianity."

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Part 9 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-nine.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"The prisca sapienta correlation between time and distance in the prophecy of the book of Daniel should also relate to the Revelation of John. Newton viewed the book of Revelation in the New Testament as a mirror of Daniel’s prophecies in the Old Testament. Revelation recapitulated the theme of Babylon’s fall and focused on the temple as a unifying point of prophetic dimension, a fact that Newton closely detailed in Observations. Both Daniel and John addressed the theme of time of the end and the return of Christ:"

"The Apocalypse of John is written in the same style and language with the Prophecies of Daniel, and hath the same relation to them which they have to one another, so that all of them together make but one complete Prophecy; and in like manner it consists of two parts, an introductory Prophecy, and an interpretation thereof."

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Part 10 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-ten.htm

From the works of David Flynn

"The most prominent feature of the Ark of the Covenant, as well every “ark” found in the Bible, is its movement over the Earth from one point to another under the navigation of God."

"An Ark carried Moses along the Nile to the daughter of Pharaoh. The Ark of Noah navigated the deluge to the dry summit of Mount Ararat . The Ark of the Covenant traveled before the tribes of the Exodus to the Promised Land. All three contained “seeds” for the future of mankind designed for planting at their destination. All carried or were followed by a portion of humanity under God’s protection, leading to a realm of life and promise out of a land of destruction and death."

"The movement from one point to another across the earth necessarily produces an arc, as the Earth itself is a sphere. Speed is measured by the length of time it takes to travel over a set distance. These concepts are most commonly defined by the physics of Newton’s Calculus, which determines instantaneous rates of change, and may be used to find the velocity (rate of change of distance with respect to time) of an object moving through space or the slope of a curve at any given point. Calculus is necessary for finding arc length and measuring the area of a region bounded by a curve."

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Part 11 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-eleven.htm

From the works of David Flynn


"In the Gregorian calendar, AD is an abbreviation of the Latin Anno Domini, meaning “in the year of our Lord.” Apart from the birth of Christ, on which the modern calendar is based, his resurrection is the most important event in Christianity. Most chronologists assign the age of Christ’s death and resurrection to 33 years. Newton also agreed with this chronology and listed the passion of Jesus as having occurred no later than AD 34 in chapter 11 of Observations upon the Prophecies of Daniel and the Apocalypse of St. John."

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Part 12 http://www.raidersnewsupdate.com/flynn-twelve.htm

From the works of David Flynn


"When Constantine converted pagan Rome to Catholicism, he superimposed Christian motifs over pre-existing sun worship cults. He himself worshipped the god Sol Invictus (the invincible sun) until his death. Constantine declared dies Solis, “Sun-day,” as the official day of rest for the empire on March 7, AD 321, minted coins bearing Helios crowned with the spiked rays, and established Christ’s nativity on the pagan date of the birth of the sun, December 25."







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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by IPFreely on Sun Sep 09, 2012 6:35 pm

Reminds me of a account i read many years back. From what I remember this man found himself in a darkened place leaning downhill. He heard voices beckoning him to move downward and as he did it got darker and he began to feel people tearing at him, he then was told this is what you face if you continue as you have. then he was revived. if was true I do not know and it was so long ago I have no idea where I read it. But I did find it interesting not the normal seeing the light story.
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:02 pm

Interesting story, ScaRZ.

I was surprised by moments in his account, when he presumed he would petition God and assumed his life work would implore God to grant his plea. The immaturity is astounding....and childishly arrogant.

How many Pastors, Reverends, Priests and Clergy, view their understanding of faith through such spiritually rudimentary and presumptuous self centered glasses?

The sad part to me in this, is the congregations they lead. The church teaching they receive concerning Christian Theology, will inevitably be tarnished by the narrow impoverished view of their leaders. Passed on and assimilated in their conscious as sound view and perception.

The Pharisee syndrome is still widely flourishing today.

--------------------

Anyway…. Nice to see he learned his lessons. Fascinating story. Thanks

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Bard on Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:13 am

When Buddhist, Hindus, Native Americans, Muslims, etc have NDE's do you believe they experience the God of Israel and His messengers or do they experience Near Death donned with the tapestries of faith and belief they walked with through their life?

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:09 am

Thanks IP,Jake,and Mdonnall for taking the time to listen or read the material.

As I mentioned I certainly tried not to let my thinking and beliefs take over as I was listening and reading the experience of Howard Pittman. For me it is impossible to even think of none of my beliefs entering my mind.

I have never to this day had a near-death experience. What it is or isn't I only have my thoughts. I certainly believe these people have experienced "Something", but beyond that the why's and why not's remain a mystery.


Once again I speak only of reaching as far as I can without my own beliefs taking over......."The only way we will ever know of something beyond this life we now find ourselves in,will be "If" we have knowledge of this "Life" beyond this life."

If we die and there be nothing,then nothing is nothing.

When we die however in this life we now live, if we live again and have no knowledge of our life and death then all we will know is that we have life. It will be as if our old life never was. If there are no memories then no matter what may have truly been,it will not exist for us.



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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:13 am

mdonnall2002 wrote:When Buddhist, Hindus, Native Americans, Muslims, etc have NDE's do you believe they experience the God of Israel and His messengers or do they experience Near Death donned with the tapestries of faith and belief they walked with through their life?

I believe...."experience Near Death donned with the tapestries of faith and belief they walked with through their life"

I have read a couple books on NDE and closely followed Dr Suzanne Gordon's thread at the original OMF. She was "Spinningshields", a Moderator of OMF. And a professional researcher of the NDE phenomena.

The United Nations is currently conducting a multi-national scientific study of NDE's in co-op with hospital O.R. monitoring.

I am persuaded to believe the phenomena is real. Which for Biblical believer's provides supportive proof for the Great White Throne. IOW, all souls survive death of the body.

ScaRZ makes a point that I concur with.....

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:25 am

ScaRZ wrote:
Once again I speak only of reaching as far as I can without my own beliefs taking over......."The only way we will ever know of something beyond this life we now find ourselves in,will be "If" we have knowledge of this "Life" beyond this life."

If we die and there be nothing,then nothing is nothing.

When we die however in this life we now live, if we live again and have no knowledge of our life and death then all we will know is that we have life. It will be as if our old life never was. If there are no memories then no matter what may have truly been,it will not exist for us.
Indeed. This is why I often refer to reincarnation as the religion of perpetual death. The only way to break free is through accepting the Grace of G-d. It's free, but accepting the Grace -and- giving one's life into the hands of the Giver, during this life, is required.

Which isn't much of a requirement.

But this world tries hard to convince the soul that such a requirement is a heavy price to pay. The world makes it easier for a soul to be crazy, than to be sane.



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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:46 pm

Jake Reason wrote:
But this world tries hard to convince the soul that such a requirement is a heavy price to pay. The world makes it easier for a soul to be crazy, than to be sane.

You went straight to the heart. I really like the words you used.

I see two desires that war within all of us. The desire to follow our flesh and the desire to follow the spirit. How many forget that Jesus was also a flesh man? Do we not understand that he also had the desire of flesh as well as the desire of the spirit?

We hear of the deity of Jesus all the time,but mostly silence comes of the human flesh side of Jesus.


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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:40 am

ScaRZ wrote:
Jake Reason wrote:
But this world tries hard to convince the soul that such a requirement is a heavy price to pay. The world makes it easier for a soul to be crazy, than to be sane.

You went straight to the heart. I really like the words you used.
Thank you.

I see two desires that war within all of us. The desire to follow our flesh and the desire to follow the spirit. How many forget that Jesus was also a flesh man? Do we not understand that he also had the desire of flesh as well as the desire of the spirit?

We hear of the deity of Jesus all the time,but mostly silence comes of the human flesh side of Jesus.


Yes. I've also noted a curious thing with Preachers and Teachers during this generation. Few quote 'Jesus" words when making a point. Rather they quote every other scripture instead.

I have a theory... it's because of guilt. People are afraid of his direct teaching. It makes them feel lowly and spiritually unaccomplished.



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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:06 am

I think a lot of people have a problem seeing Jesus as a human flesh man. He was The Son of Man as well as The Son of God. They will say,"Oh sure he was part human." But how far do they really see his human side.

There have been so many artistic images that influence our vision of Jesus. From the time he was just an infant we tend to view Jesus as sticking out like a sore thumb. Oh yes! and don't forget that huge bright hallow above his head.

Jesus had to drink,eat,and go potty like every other human. Jesus wasn't born knowing how to talk and walk. He fell and skinned his knees also. Jesus went through puberty as all of us.

Jesus wasn't only tempted once and that was it.

Jesus wasn't born into this world with all knowledge and understanding either. He grew in his wisdom and knowledge.

Luke 2:52........"And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man."

Notice the words "God and man". This shows both sides of the coin of the spirit side as well as the human side.

Jesus advanced in wisdom and maturity in all respects.




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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Admin on Fri Sep 21, 2012 10:07 pm

Hi guys, I'm just getting caught up with reading your threads. This is very interesting for me as a person raised outside of exposure to the contents of the Bible.

thumbs up.

@ IPFreely, you do not need permission to begin threads. Please feel free to create any thread(s) in/under any subject you wish for your wife. She is most welcome here. She need not fear in regards to her talents and its contributions, there are others here among us who also experience advanced abilities.

Cyrellys


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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:32 am

The World's First Super-Soldier

Wed, August 8, 2012

http://blogtalk.vo.llnwd.net/o23/show/3/477/show_3477025.mp3


Tonight, we will be talking with Dr. Mike Bennett about the world's first super-soldier: Nimrod. To some, he is known as Doctor Future of the radio program, Future Quake. He served as a leader in a military lab for sixteen years, developing protection technologies and other weird science contraptions. He is an inventor and an author (among other things). His contribution (chapter 2) to Tom Horn's book, Pandemonium's Engine really caught my attention, so buckle your seatbelts, this is going to be a fun show!

**************************

The Second Coming of Antichrist


Thu, September 13, 2012

http://blogtalk.vo.llnwd.net/o23/show/3/758/show_3758105.mp3


We all know about the Second Coming of Jesus Christ. But what about the second coming of the ANTI-Christ? Could it be that the Antichrist is truly a direct antithesis of Jesus in every way? Will he also resurrect? Will the first be the last? Find out tonight as we speak with author/researcher, Peter Goodgame!
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:01 am

Can Unbelievers Please God?

Very interesting question and topic that Michael Heiser brought up. I thought I would post the question here at OM and give others a chance to lay out their thoughts.

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Bard on Mon Oct 01, 2012 7:37 pm

I am going to assume that you are speaking about the God if Israel. This is truly thought provoking question.

Is it fair to assume that God may not even be pleased with those who claim to be believers, his champions of truth?

Human assumption leads many into thinking that God is pleased by church attendance, tithing, and bible study within the assembly on Sunday, not Gods affirmation directly unto us individually. Mortal pride is the ‘day trader’ that compels many to raise their spiritual stock and covet together in those riches, tarnished with vanity.

Does it please God to know that the holiest of men/women under Him fear to lower themselves to associate with sinners to bring them closer? Did not Jesus dine and receive them?

Does it please God to see a flock that would rather ‘preen’ themselves than to help preen an unbeliever? In order to bring about change you have to bring it closer – not by casting it out, by seclusion, by silence, by hate, nor by threat of arrest.

God probably is more concerned with how those that have risen to spiritual elite are representing themselves in His name within the grand halls across the globe than those souls’ voids of His name - who remain locked into a sometimes violent innocence within jungles and forests - closest to the dawn of creation.
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:21 pm

mdonnall, two thumbs up!

The question that Heiser poses is elementary [school]. And I suspect his answer will reside within an elementary perspective, as well. Not to say Heiser is elementary, but that his selected audience is.

And respectfully I understand that most live their whole lives within an elementary construct. This is not to say I imply an empirically greater order of understanding, to myself. For whatever advancement one perceives above or below another, is still relatively infinitesimal gap, compared to the heavenly realms above us lowly beings.

With humility, I think the better question is, as Mdonnall implied....

Can believers please God?

Anything less than this higher question, is folly.


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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:11 am

I feel that the answer to either question, is the same.

I have never understood the concept as rational. Of course I have heard people talk about pleasing God, but it always perplexes me, as to how they could have such a small conception of God.

I would never encourage a child to think they could please God.

However I would teach; they are a glory to G-d.


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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:08 am

Michael Heiser brings up this type of question attempting to get people to think about the whole of the question. He isn't interested in making someone look bad if they are a non-believer or a believer.

It is a very good question to get one digging into scripture. This I believe is his ultimate goal. Lay out scripture to back up why you answer the question as you do.

Remember first and foremost that Michael Heiser is a Biblical Scholar.


When I read his question on his blog these were the first questions I ask myself about his question.

Where in scripture have unbelievers pleased God?

Where in scripture have believers pleased God?


A good teacher can teach to all students in the classroom no matter how low level or how advanced. We all begin as babes and must learn to walk before we can run. In every question there is learning for all of us.
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Jake Reason on Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:47 pm

I understand ScaRZ, and I respect that. I was just answering the question in my view. I look forward to Heiser's answer. Please post us a link when he publishes.

Thanks

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:34 am

Sure thing Jake,I will post it as soon as Michael lays out his full material.

I decided I would let others get their thoughts down, scripture,or both before I gave mine. I just didn't want it to be me right from the beginning.


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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Bard on Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:29 am

Scarz:


Has Michael ever finished his book on the Divine Council? Last I read it was in draft....

I passed Heiser's name/work onto an senior by age 'elementary' who seems to have begun his work into eschatology in the last year or so. He has refused to look at the phenomenon with a more critical eye over the past couple years, but then admits recently that he 'saw something' many years ago alongside a country road that people had all stopped to gawk at late one night that dumbfounded him. "It was huge and I regret not speaking to everyone else that was watching it."

It reminded me of the Stevensville incident.

Apparently, he is more concerned with my salvation than the possibility of a great awakening. His heart is pure and in the right place, but still so young in the eve of his days. Everyone needs a grounding rod, I suppose.

I probably should not has posed the question: "Is is possible that other creatures from Gods creation could be free from Sin and here today? I may have hours of debates ahead.








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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:11 pm

Hello mdonnall2002,as far as I know Michael's book remains in draft form. He has brought this up on one or more of his blogs. He has so many things going on he finds himself not putting the finishing touch on things that should have been completed a long time ago.

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The question you ask I have been ask on several occasions from believers as well as non-believers.

"Is is possible that other creatures from Gods creation could be free from Sin and here today?"

I will give you some of my thoughts right off the top of my head.

The first thing that I see is Michael the archangel and his angels (Messengers). Of coarse he isn't the only one that I would call Upper Class Messengers but he is the only one referred to in the Bible as an archangel. The Host of Heaven are not only the suns,moons,and star systems that fill the night time sky. They are the Army of God and I believe Michael is in charge of this massive army.

Remember that even Gabriel had to be rescued from the Prince of Persia by Michael the archangel as written about in Daniel 10.


Can Messengers sin?.......Sin is rebellion against God,and most certainly they can rebel.

I believe that the vast majority of Messengers have remained free of rebellion.

Are these Messengers with no rebellion among us today?.....I certainly believe they are.

Can we see them?.....I will put it this way,"They could as they did in the past."


I also believe Michael the archangel is the one in charge of restraining the dark forces as well as the forces of nature. In other words he keeps things from really getting out of hand. There will come a time when Michael will stop restraining by standing aside. These will be the darkest of days leading up to the Coming of Jesus Christ.



I believe all creation has been effected by rebellion. This does not mean anything more than what I said....."Effected".

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As far as creatures or creations similar to humans or animal types (flesh and blood or similar to human flesh and blood),I will say I can't rule out anything God chooses to create. Certainly I believe they also could rebel.

If God is truly Love,then how is it possible for true love to exist in his creation without a free will? Without free will how can there be "True Love"? Anything that is forced is not true love....."Is it"?






Last edited by ScaRZ on Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by HouTexan on Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:23 pm

IPFreely wrote:I Scarz yep it the same IP from when OM first started so long ago. I wanted you to know my wife read your reply and wanted me to thank you for the invitation. I think maybe if she could have a thread to bring some spiritual discussion to OM that would be great. What do you all think?

If the thread was created, you can count on me to join the discussion Very Happy
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by HouTexan on Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:52 pm

I have greatly enjoyed reading the thread and look forward to further discussion.

I always say, "less flesh, more spirit." However, I can honestly say that without the sin of flesh, I would never have, myself, began a mutual relationship with God. No, I don't attempt to please Him. I've found that to be counter-productive and based on human perception of pleasing, what is right, and what is wrong. Way off. Rather, I understand what pulls me away from Him and what strengthens my faith with Him. And through that understanding, I work to strengthen my faith.

On the NDE, we are all connected on a spiritual "network," if you will. Yes, our NDE may echo the culture/religious views we've based our life on, but only one God reveals the truth behind it all.

The mystery of God's love is ever apparent, and as we follow our Lord the more His love grounds reality. My Religious Studies professor in college taught me something great -- finding God's love is as easy as walking to your mailbox, getting the mail, opening an envelope and reading. His love is so real, that once we receive...how can we turn from it? Oh wait, the struggle of flesh and spirit Surprised
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:19 am

Great to have you here HouTexan. I look forward to your input.

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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by ScaRZ on Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:55 am

ScaRZ wrote:Can Unbelievers Please God?

Very interesting question and topic that Michael Heiser brought up. I thought I would post the question here at OM and give others a chance to lay out their thoughts.


I was waiting for Michael Heiser's Part 2 where he will lay out more detail in answering the question as he did. I've decided to post Part 1 and when he does a follow up I will post it also. Be sure and click the link for the full article.

I have underlined on my own Michael Heiser's answer to his question.

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Can Unbelievers Please God? Part 1


http://michaelsheiser.com/TheNakedBible/2012/09/unbelievers-god-part-1/



Most readers are familiar with the idea of “total depravity” as taught by many Christian theologians over the centuries — the idea that (in overly broad strokes) humans are unable to turn themselves to God and are inherently sinful. Those who have read with some depth in theology know that theologians disagree as to how to articulate total depravity, at least in part because it touches on many things.

One of the issues raised in a discussion of total depravity is whether unbelievers, those who have not been regenerated and “saved” through personal faith in Christ, can ever actually please God in any way. Put another way, the idea is that an unbeliever can never truly do something that God would look at and say something like, “good job”; “I liked that”; “glad to see you did that”; etc., but would always have some point of dissatisfaction or spiritual criticism — the act would further sour God’s disposition toward the unbeliever who is “under wrath.” The counter assumption is, then, that believers can indeed satisfy God in this way — meet this standard — whereas the unbeliever cannot (ever).

I think this way of looking at things is theologically amiss, but I won’t say why until Part 2. Suffice it to say now that I reject any notion that an unbeliever can turn themselves toward God in any salvation sense, or merit God’s grace in any way. That is, an unbeliever cannot do anything “spiritually good” with respect to meriting or moving toward salvation in any causative way. But that’s different than the question I’m raising: can an unbeliever ever please God? I say they can. God can indeed look at something an unbeliever does and approve of it and take pleasure in it (or be indifferent to it) and that such occasions have nothing to do with the “salvation distance” between God and that person becoming more narrow. They are two separate issues.
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Re: The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

Post by Bard on Thu Oct 04, 2012 8:22 am

ScaRZ wrote:

Remember that even Gabriel had to be rescued from the Prince of Persia by Michael the archangel as written about in Daniel 10.



New International Version

But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty-one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, because I was detained there with the king of Persia.

This would be an excellent topic for further discussion.

How would an Angel of God - capable of such greatness and power be Held at bay by a mortal man and require assistance from Michael? What kept Gabriel with Persia insomuch that he could not remove himself? Is it fair to assume that a spiritual being, a messenger of God, would be able to simply exert a force to be where he needed to be instantly to convey the message and return to station? With so few chiefs of angels where were the subordinates that serve under Gabriel to hold Persia at bay while he conveyed with Daniel?

Apparently, God's messengers cannot be in two locations at the same time. Angels all powerful? What was Gabriel doing - 'affecting/influencing the minds' of the Persian elite.....

Some things never change?


Detained? Seems like a poor word to use, but it does state Michael came to his aid, without any mention of his subordinates either? With two thirds of the angelic forces at their disposal - The Chiefs seemingly must accomplish all the work.







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