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UFOs, Extraterrestrial Contact, Conspiracy, Exopolitics, Geopolitics, Paranormal, Crypto-zoology, Ancient History, Cutting-Edge Science & Special Guests.

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» WRATH OF THE GODS/TITANS
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeYesterday at 8:36 pm by U

» Why are we here?
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 23, 2024 7:59 am by dan

» OMF STATE OF THE UNION
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeFri Nov 22, 2024 10:22 pm by U

» Disclosure - For U by U
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeThu Nov 21, 2024 10:08 pm by U

» The scariest character in all fiction
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeThu Nov 21, 2024 6:47 pm by U

» Uanon's Majikal Misery Tour "it's all smiles on the magic school bus"
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeSun Nov 10, 2024 9:36 pm by Mr. Janus

» What Music Are You Listening To ?
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 09, 2024 12:34 am by U

» Livin Your Best Life
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeWed Nov 06, 2024 8:55 am by Post Eschaton Punk

» Baudrillardian hauntology - what are some haunting truths to our reality?
Personalism 102 - Page 34 Icon_minitimeSun Nov 03, 2024 3:07 pm by dan

Where did all the Open Minds Forum members go?

Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:29 pm by Admin

With Open Minds Forum restored now for almost half a year at it's new location with forumotion.com we can now turn to look at reaching out to OMF's original members who have not yet returned home. OMF's original membership was over 6,000 members strong, prior to the proboards suspension, according to the rolls of the time. We can probably safely assume that some of those accounts were unidentified socks. If we were to assume a reasonable guess of maybe as many as 30% possible sock accounts then that would leave potentially somewhere between 4800 to 4900 possible real members to locate. That is still a substantial number of people.

Who were all these people? Some were average individuals with common interests in ufology, exopolitics, globalism, corruption, earthchanges, science and technology, and a variety of other interests. Some just enjoyed being part of a vibrant and unusually interesting community. Others were representative of various insider groups participating in observation and outreach projects, while still others were bonafide intelligence community personnel. All with stake in the hunt for truth in one fashion or another. Some in support of truth, and communication. Others seeking real disclosure and forms of proof. And others highly skeptical of anything or limited subjects. The smallest division of membership being wholly anti-disclosure oriented.

So where did these members vanish to? They had many options. There are almost innumerable other forums out there on the topics of UFO's or Exopolitics, the Unexplained, and Conspiracy Theory. Did they disappear into the world-wide network of forum inhabitants? Did some go find new homes on chatrooms or individual blogs? Did they participate in ufo conventions or other public events and gatherings? How about those who represented groups in special access? Or IC and military observers? Those with academic affiliations? Where did they all go and what would be the best way to reach out and extend an invitation to return?

And what constitutes a situation deserving of their time and participation? Is the archive enough? How exactly do people within the paradigm most desire to define a community? Is it amenities, humanity or simply population size for exposure? Most of the special guests have been emailed and have expressed that population size for exposure is what most motivates them. But not all. Long-time member Dan Smith has other priorities and values motivating his participation. Should this open opportunities for unattached junior guests who have experience and dialog to contribute to the world? How best to make use of OMF's time, experience and resources?

Many skeptics would like to see the historical guardian of discourse opportunity to just up and disappear; go into permanent stasis. They think that not everyone has a right to speak about their experiences and if there is no proof involved then there can philosophically be no value to discourse. I personally would respectfully disagree with them. Discourse has always been the prelude to meaningful relationships and meaningful mutual relationships have always been the prelude to exchanges of proof. In a contentious social environment with regards to communication vs disclosure how do we best re-establish a haven for those preludes? Is it only the "if we build it they will come" answer? Well considering OMF has been largely fully functional over the last four or five months this line of reasoning is not necessarily true. So what would be the best way re-establish this? Your suggestions are sought. Please comment.





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    Personalism 102

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    Post by dan Fri Dec 23, 2022 2:19 pm

    First topic message reminder :

    This is a topic reminder post……

    Personalism 102 is just a continuation Personalism 101…….. as we approach the limit of 40 pages.  

    The contention remains that the best possible world is necessarily based on the philosophy and ontology of Personalism.  

    The ontology is immaterialism, taken at it’s most fundamental level.

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    Post by dan Thu Aug 03, 2023 8:13 pm

    Gary,

    Yes, God has sewn confusion amongst us.  

    Why would she do a bad thing like that?  

    She was telling us that we were too smart by half.  

    If we were not tripped up, we would not be sufficiently challenged.  

    God had to hide from us.  

    The only place she could hide was behind Nature, or within ourselves.

    History had to play out.

    Creation had to fulfill its purpose.

    Which was to confuse us?  

    Which was to keep us on our toes……. force us to stand on our own.

    If God were not hidden, we would be hiding under her skirts.



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    Post by dan Fri Aug 04, 2023 6:09 am

    Loons, crooks and worse………

    I’m not quite sure what Ron is, but he has always considered me a bit of a loon.

    Maybe I haven’t fully lived up to that designation.  

    Perhaps I will need to own the Metanarrative.  

    Perhaps I will need to go fully solipsistic……. referring to the I Am……. and being the first with the Truth, historically speaking.

    Story, story, who’s got the story?  

    What do we call the person who comes up with the best possible story?  

    Is this the spirit of the truth?  

    Yes, we are all coCreators, but…….. somewhere, somewhen, the story was going to have to meet the history…….. the rubber would have to meet the road.

    Is this the best possible time and place?



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    Post by GSB Fri Aug 04, 2023 6:49 am

    Dan:

    Ron may be watching you to see if evolution takes you to that next level (crook!)

    Well, there was that boat incident in the bay -- does that qualify!?


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    Post by dan Fri Aug 04, 2023 6:56 am

    Boat 🛶 in the bay……..?

    Which incident was that?  

    Which boat in which bay?

    The one I’m remembering, now, was the boat on St Catherine’s Island 🏝️…….

    But, now I’m remembering the sailboat ⛵ in SF Bay.  

    Yes, that was also a bit of an adventure……..

    But right now, I’m talking about inventing the world……. the best possible world.  

    This was going to be the conspiracy to end all conspiracies.

    The problem was that I was conflating the story with the History.

    I had forgotten about teleology.  

    With teleology, the invention would come at the end.  

    That doesn’t make much sense, either…… so we’ll just have to compromise, and do it in the middle.  

    But that’s not right, either.  

    We invent it outside of time, and then have some poor sucker do a cameo toward the end of the story.

    Is this what happened with the jguy?  

    He must have drawn the short straw…… really short!  

    But what happens to the I Am……. that initial quantum observer.  

    It’s not clear that he ever really got off the drawing board, so to speak!  

    And now this is all coming up at the last possible moment, because of Elizondo, Grusch and Puthoff &Company…… talk about conspiracies!

    The cover of the cosmic conspiracy is just about to be blown.  

    When it finally blows…… everything is gonna blow…… and there’ll be the great reunion………. er, the wedding feast in the sky.  

    The great trick was aletheia, and the crossing of the river Styx.  

    Yes, this all started with the Dreamtime.  

    Beyond the Dreamtime……. we’re outside of time……. all the world’s a stage.

    There will be a lot of us who are not overly enamored with this story, and I guess it’s my job, here and now, to apologize on behalf of……. ourselves……… if you think that you drew a short straw, you get to think about the jguy.  

    While we’re at it, we could feel sorry for the SoT…….. but, hey, I got the Princess in compensation……. setting aside the Pelican, for the nonce.  

    So, if I’m so smart, I should have been able to figure out how it worked.  

    No such luck!  

    I don’t even know how the Puthoff conspiracy worked, much less how the stars ✨ and fossils work………
    Don't know much about history
    Don't know much biology
    Don't know much about a science book
    Don't know much about the French I took
    But I do have the strong suspicion that this was a set up…….. sub specie aeternitatis!  

    How do teleology and the Dreamtime work?  

    Who counts the hairs on our heads?  

    Hey, what else could we do for all eternity, but figure this out?  

    And which one of us was going to win the lottery?  

    Like they say in the Army……. be careful what you wish for!  

    What about the I Am?  

    Who invented the original conspiracy…… from within Eternity, or not?  

    Whose imaginary playmates are we?

    If we really want to know, we’ll find out at the big Reveal.

    What we’re likely to find out is that there is only one of us, anyway.

    And we are all that One, each in our own way.

    Who was it…… John Rawls…… and what was………. the cosmic veil of ignorance……. the river Lethe……



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    Post by Post Eschaton Punk Fri Aug 04, 2023 11:33 am

    It was fun to spend some time with a true loon.

    Peace to you Dan.
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    Post by dan Sat Aug 05, 2023 11:38 am

    Take care, Chivo……

    You and your links will be missed.  

    Yes, room temperature super-conductors could give scientific materialism a reprieve from an otherwise imminent demise.  

    Are we holding our breath?  

    Looking at the larger picture, we can afford to be more than a bit skeptical.  
    ………….


    My contention is that scientific materialism remains highly vulnerable from any number of directions.  

    It’s living past its sell-by date because we are understandably reluctant to embrace its alternative……. immaterialism.
    …………


    It’s straightforward to invoke a primordial panpsychism unattached to any substrate.

    At some point, there is a virtual fluctuation in this background…… invoking the I Am.

    This is a bootstrap operation…… or think of it as the seminal Word, inseminating the cosmic egg or Hiranyagarbha.

    The BPW is already present in some embryonic form.

    Yes, I’m sorry, this is the best Just So Story I can produce……. after nearly half a century!

    The main thing I wish to avoid is a Multiverse.  

    There is nothing here to prevent duplication.

    Is it important to prevent cosmic twins 👯‍?    

    We could invoke a cosmic catbird to push its rivals out of the nest 🪺.  

    There is the cosmic cheat……. invoke Eternity.

    Space and time exist only virtually.

    Population control is perhaps the perquisite of the I Am.  

    Otherwise, personalism is crapshoot.

    Even our virtual/pseudo cosmic quantum observer must be sapient, in order for the observation to entangle with the Logos Spermatikos.

    In some strong sense, you and I were present at the beginning.

    We are all the imaginary playmates of the I Am.

    Primordially, everything was entangled.  

    There was no wiggle room for duplication.

    The whole kitandcaboddle was necessarily a singularity…… the best possible one, right from the gitgo.  

    We may simply invoke Pratityasamutpada, if you prefer.  

    This is personalism is all…… it’s necessarily and uniquely interpersonal.

    Will 10^10 of us suffice for Eternity?  

    Should we do a recount?

    Did we miss anyone?  

    Did everyone get to vote?  

    But remember there has only ever been one of us.

    Couldn’t there have been some stowaways?  

    Yes, there were the best possible number of stowaways.  

    In some strong sense, the internet is reprising the primordial entanglement.

    But remember that we are not dealing with cause and effect.

    The Alpha is contained in the Omega…… and the Omega is contained in the Alpha.  

    Yes, and the jguy is the Alpha&Omega……. the primordial sapient One.

    Was there competition for who would be first?  

    Not really……. the first shall be last, and the last shall be first…..
    And he spent a long time watching from his lonely wooden tower
    And when he knew for certain only drowning men could see him
    He said all men will be sailors then until the sea shall free them
    But he himself was broken, long before the sky would open
    Forsaken, almost human, he sank beneath your wisdom like a stone
    Every atom is a microcosm……. each has the potential for all life and knowledge.

    Every musical fragment hides the whole song in its heart.

    Every number reflects all other numbers…….
    And she shows you where to look among the garbage and the flowers
    There are heroes in the seaweed, there are children in the morning
    They are leaning out for love and they will lean that way forever



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    Post by dan Sun Aug 06, 2023 5:34 am

    Ding dong, the witch is dead…….

    Now it looks like I have OM to myself………

    Now we can get down to the nitty gritty…….. of the small world…….

    We just have to ask ourselves……. if you wanted to run a small world, how would you go about it?  

    The first thing I would do is open my eyes and ears……. and see how this one works.  

    And see if I could do it any better.  

    Not surprisingly, the answer is…… no.  

    One day, I woke up and looked around me.  

    I saw that my dad was doing interesting stuff…… so I tuned into that.

    I even took a freshman economics course at college.  

    I was not terribly impressed……. it was just a game that folks had learned to play, over the millennia.  

    It could run itself, if you didn’t let the politicians muck it up, too badly.

    My dad worked on the least intrusive tax policy.  

    We might be tempted to say that he was rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic……. which he began to realize, in hindsight.  

    So, I kept an eye on the games that folks were playing, and decided to go for the jugular…….. well, what I thought was the jugular……. physics.  

    And it was…….. when I finally found about the Anthropic Principle.  

    The AP was above top secret…… then, and still now, to a large extent.  

    What was that about?  

    In hindsight, it was about following the bouncing ball……. it was about the Metanarrative.  

    Yes, where there is an AP, there must also be a Metanarrative.  

    Well, that’s if we can take the Big Bang ❗ with a grain of salt 🧂.  

    All we had to do was a gestalt switch……. the MoAPS.

    And that was pretty easy, once we realized how the jguy worked.

    Hey, it was all about cosmology…… or, more accurately, about micro cosmics.  

    If you want to understand micro cosmology, you just have to understand about atoms ⚛ and about the Mandelbrot and about the Riemann Hypothesis.  

    And, once you’ve seen something, how do you say something?

    You have to figure out how to call ‘911’.  

    You have to figure out how the Pelican works.

    That’s all, folks!  

    Clearly, the chick 🐣 was too smart….. by half.  

    Sorry, what was I supposed to do about that…….. other than get my *ss over to OM?  

    End of story?

    It’s all over but the shouting.  

    And how will the shouting work…….?

    I’m told that there are plenty of folks who have seen behind the curtain…… who have been able to take their eyes 👀 off the ball long enough to figure out what’s going on.

    All we have to do is figure out MJ12 and the Aviary.  

    The folks who have a need to know, already know.  

    That’s how it has always worked.  

    Then we just have to figure out the best possible Eschaton.  

    Just like with God, the best possible Eschaton is the least possible Eschaton.  

    IOW, we are about to have our close encounter with the Eschaton.

    Yes, things will get a bit topsy-turvey.  

    All we have to do is hang onto our hats 🧢……. and to our heads…. yes, and our hearts 💕.  

    We will just be having a bit of a shake-down cruise 🚢, on our way to the Wedding Feast in the sky.  

    Hey, it’s no biggie.  

    Just remember…. there has ever been only one of us.

    The first will be last……. etc.  

    We will all be one with the One…… so enjoy the ride.  

    Just keep Paul Gauguin in mind…….. where are we…… from whence did we come….. and whither do we go?  

    One more thing…….. do try to keep the faith!  

    And, yes, it is a small world……. very small…… chick 🐣.  

    And, yes, we’re meant to take that personally……. very personally!



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    Post by dan Sun Aug 06, 2023 8:54 am

    There was one thing my dad told me that made me realize that he was not clueless……..

    If you wanted to run the world would you choose the Harvard Board of Overseers, or would you randomly pick 12 names out of the Cambridge telephone directory?  

    It gave me pause…….. but then I was only twelve years old.  

    You take wisdom where you find it.  
    ……….  


    And what’s the message from the stars ✨?

    It’s pretty much the same……. it’s time for us to step up to the plate.  

    We’re about to be pitched a cosmic softball 🥎……

    And, yes, we’re gonna hit it out of the park!  
    ……..


    Let that not be a plot spoiler.  

    And how does the Pelican work?  

    Like all the rest of us…… he does the job that’s put in front of him.

    His job is to keep his eyes 👀 on things, and make sure that none of us strays too far outside the navigational beacons.

    If anyone does…….. that’s his responsibility.  

    When the Pelican calls, I make sure to pick up the phone.

    Anyone who doesn’t…… must have a guilty conscience.  

    Back when we had that intrusion, he asked me to stop 🛑 blogging.

    He was telling me to stop doing my job.

    That’s the only thing he can’t tell me.

    His is a small family……… of loons, crooks……. and worse.

    When will the Senators figure it out…….?  The ones who need to know, already do.  

    When will the ufologists figure that out?

    They may be among the last.

    So what was the intrusion?  

    Was it a warning shot?  

    I think it was more like a test shot……. no…. a wake up call ☎………
    Oh, let the sun beat down upon my face
    And stars fill my dream
    I'm a traveler of both time and space
    To be where I have been
    To sit with elders of the gentle race
    This world has seldom seen
    They talk of days for which they sit and wait
    All will be revealed



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    Post by dan Mon Aug 07, 2023 8:45 am

    Navigational beacons………

    Human endeavor can be fairly random.

    The end of human endeavor brings upon itself cosmic constraints.  

    The Teleology is inescapable.

    There cannot be rampant competition.  

    Chaos has its time and place.

    The boundaries of history…… the Alpha and Omega are not the times to have us running wild.  

    The Pelican would be a small part of those checks and balances.
    ……….


    Back to a personal monism is where we’re headed.

    There will be a conceptual and ontological convergence back to the I Am.  

    That there is a singular global consciousness is our primary portent for our reunion.

    The Alpha is contained in the Omega, and the Omega in the Alpha…… the jguy being the A/O.

    This is the metaphysics of Pratityasamutpada.

    All spiritual traditions will be represented and absorbed in the harmony.

    All traditions point to a unison.

    There is the Monad, the Trinity, the Olympiad, etc……

    Where will science fit into this picture?  

    Science has pushed us into an extreme monism.

    When scientific materialism collapses, mostly under its own weight, we are left with a monistic immaterialism.

    Matter has been unable to support mind….. we naturally move to the other side.

    The unreasonable effectiveness of mathematics provides us with our conceptual pivot.

    Appreciating the quasi magic of the Mandelbrot and the Riemann Hypothesis will take us most of the way beyond materialism.

    Then it is a relatively modest leap to appeal to the quantum aspect of a primordial observer….. necessarily contained in the Telos/Omega.

    The Anthropics of the Final Cause comes as no surprise.  

    All we are lacking is the opening of the portals.  

    Our final portal is simply our cosmic navel….. fashioned as is the blind spot out of the entanglement of our optic nerves.  

    We recall the fear that the Large Hadron Collider was going to create a black hole 🕳️ that would swallow the world.  

    More apt might be that the Internet accelerated with artificial intelligence will enable a global resonance of consciousness…… but don’t hold me to that……..
    Battleships confide in me and tell me where you are,
    Shining, flying, purple wolfhound, show me where you are,
    Lost in summer, morning, winter, travel very far,
    Lost in musing circumstances, that's just where you are….



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    Post by dan Tue Aug 08, 2023 8:27 am

    Yes, most of us much prefer our personalism…… LITE!  

    Aren’t we the cosmic lightweights?  

    I wouldn’t be so sure about that.  

    We’re just observers…… aren’t we?  

    That depends on what metaphysics you ascribe to Observation.  

    Me?  I subscribe to quantum Observation.

    When speaking of an alleged Multiverse, I just quote John Wheeler…… the only real phenomenon is the observed phenomenon.  

    And what does observation mean?  

    I humbly suggest that observation is all or nothing.  

    There is no such thing as a partial observation.

    Unlike Chivo 🐐, chick 🐣 subscribes to personalism HEAVY!  

    Why is there something rather than nothing?  

    That’s because there can’t be a partial something.  

    There is only the best possible something……. or there is nothing.

    And I believe in entanglement….. relationalism….. interpersonalism.  

    To be is to be related.

    Our ultimate, universal relation is to be one with the One.

    Yes, it’s Pikes Peak, or bust!  

    Reality is necessarily structured into the best possible world.

    We go along to get along…… with the Metanarrative.

    Until we awake to our cosmic stage fright.

    That’s what it means to be woke!  

    When we wake up, we’re not in Kansas, anymore.  

    Yes, we walk softly, and carry a heavy Eschaton.  

    The BPW without an Eschaton is no world at all.

    You don’t like that?  

    Get over it…… get used to it!  

    We necessarily operate sub specie aeternitatis.  

    Ask for no substitute…… because there are no substitutes.  

    This is all she wrote!  
    ……..


    Many of us suppose that we are mortals.

    In point of fact, we are doubly or triply immortal.

    We don’t die.

    And we can visit anytime.

    All of us are old souls, in other words.

    But then, who’s in charge?

    Ultimately, it’s the I Am.



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    Post by dan Wed Aug 09, 2023 7:51 am

    At some point, in the not so distant future, folks are going to get tired of being told that they are basically just bags of chemicals.  

    At some point the metaphysical, ontological tables are going to be turned.  

    We just won’t take it anymore.  

    That overdue regard comes at a price……… the price is the Eschaton.

    Even the best possible Eschaton may not be an easy sell.

    If we started behaving in accordance with our best potential, could we not remain here indefinitely?  

    Would we not then have the best of both worlds…….. mortality and immortality?  

    We’d get to keep our twofer!

    One suspicion I have is that once we’ve seen Paris, it’s going to be hard to keep us down on the farm.

    Once we transcend our initial fears, we’ll be a lot more willing to release the death grip that we have on the world of mortality.

    Once the portals open, couldn’t we just keep them open?  

    I believe that, sub specie aeternitatis, we’ll retain visitation rights….. of some sort……. but this access will come after our wedding feast in the sky.  

    There may not be a rush to return.

    It’s not clear whether we would be returning to a past or future time frame.  

    We have much entanglement with the present moment.  

    Once that entanglement is loosed, it’s not clear how we might react to a reconstruction.
    ………….


    Am I suggesting that history can be changed?

    This would become increasingly problematic as public records abound.

    Can we change the future?

    What does our relational ontology have to say?  

    A great deal of the past and future remain hidden from us.  

    The true meaning of both continue to evolve.

    Conspiracy theories are wont to make this point.

    What of the time traveler who, unwittingly or not, kills a grandparent?  

    We have relational mayhem.

    An essential feature of the BPW is that space and time are illusory.

    Presentism is one such view.

    Presentism has both a weak, epistemological meaning and a much stronger, ontological connotation.

    I’m taking in its strongest sense, of course.

    Does the latter view make any sense?  

    It is sometimes referred to as the solipsism of the present moment….. or the eternal present.
    ……….


    Keep in mind that the eternal present is tantamount to the cosmic consciousness that we share….. about which physics has no clue.

    Physical time has no presence……. it is only relative.

    A shared presence implies a metaphysical monism……. some sort of I Am…… of which we all derive.

    The Anthropic Principle is practically synonymous with this presence.

    Somehow my physics professors forgot to point this out.



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    Post by dan Thu Aug 10, 2023 5:51 pm

    I have spent some time on the lengthy SEP article on Presentism.  

    The article was very much in the analytical style……. analyzing the subject to death.  

    On the other hand, the Metaphysics of Presence, which could be more significant, is given a very brief treatment.

    My own view is contextual according to the narrative that it inhibits.

    The goal of physics is abstract time and every other physical entity out of its context.

    Quantum physics has put an end to this abstraction process….. turning more towards holism.

    One aspect of the holism is the notion of Pratityasamutpada, or co-dependent arising.

    For example, Creator and Creation are co-dependent.



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    Post by dan Fri Aug 11, 2023 6:37 am

    Very clearly, the philosophical establishment, as represented by the SEP, does not know what to with Presence.

    Heidegger, with his Being and Time was the last mainstream figure to take on Presence.

    I can only point out that Presence, like everything else, is relational.

    Is presence personal?

    It seems to be entirely subjective.

    Can we not refer to a social presence?



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    Post by GSB Fri Aug 11, 2023 6:49 am

    Interesting ...

    To state that consciousness is a relativistic phenomenon is to state that there are observers in different cognitive frames of reference, yet they will nevertheless measure the same laws of nature currently in force and the same phenomenon of consciousness in their different frames. We will start with an equivalence principle between a conscious agent, like a human being, and a zombie agent, like an advanced artificial cognitive system. As a result of this equivalence, we will show that if the relativistic principle is true, then zombies are not possible. Instead, every purported zombie will actually have phenomenal consciousness and any system with adequate functional consciousness will exhibit phenomenal consciousness from the first-person cognitive frame of reference.

    https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2021.704270/full


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    Post by dan Fri Aug 11, 2023 7:45 am

    Gary,

    Zombies are not possible……..?

    So ChatGPT is conscious?  

    Yes, some individuals are claiming that.  

    But ChatGPT is not even a black box.  

    It is open sourced…….. you can follow every logical step at your leisure.  

    Would some future quantum chatbot change that verdict?  

    Would quantum entanglement make for consciousness?
    ……….


    Now, I’ve actually attempted to read the article that Gary has excerpted in his previous post.

    It is a very lengthy article, full of tensor calculus, meant to demonstrate that special relativity and the equivalence principle, when adapted to cognition, prove that zombies will experience the same qualitative aspects of consciousness as do humans.  
    …………….



    In the section on……. The Equivalence Principle of Consciousness…..
    Any two arbitrary cognitive observers that create phenomenal judgment-representations also have phenomenal consciousness. Zombies cannot exist (assuming their cognitive systems create phenomenal judgments). In other words, we obtain an equivalence between functional consciousness (which creates phenomenal judgments) and phenomenal consciousness.
    Hey, sports fans, that’s it!

    Our two authors have just claimed to have dissolved the so-called Hard Problem of consciousness.  

    What was all the tensor calculus for……… other than to intimidate any non-physicists?

    In as much as thermostats create phenomenal judgments, which they do whenever they activate switches to regulate the temperature, then, by that much are they conscious of the temperature.  

    We have approximately one hundred pages of text larded with mathematical formulae…….. all to support the equivalence between the functional and phenomenal aspects of the mind.

    Haven’t the functionalists already claimed to have done ✅ this?  

    What exactly is new here, besides the denser language and formulas?
    ………..


    Here is a related issue that Gary and I should be looking at…..

    Is there any overlap between intentionality and phenomenality?



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    Post by dan Sat Aug 12, 2023 5:53 am

    What will it take for academia to release its death grip on physicalism?  

    What will it take for the academy to concede that its hegemony on materialist orthodoxy is misplaced?  

    In other words, what will it take for the intelligentsia to concede breathing room to the metaphysicians?  

    Yes, there has been a pall of orthodoxy hanging over the academy, for centuries.  

    This orthodoxy toward secular humanism has simply become a fixture.  

    The problem, however, is as much with religion as it is with any intelligentsia.

    The last thing that religion wants is metaphysics.  

    Religion relies on orthodoxy every bit as much as science.  

    There is a robust conspiracy between science and religion to keep free thought and speculation in check.  

    Postmodernists are all over the place, but the one thing they agree upon is that any metanarrative is anathema.  

    And then, of course, any speculative dalliance with the Eschaton is frowned upon, far and wide……. don’t scare the children, for heaven’s sake!  

    Will the status quo be broken with anything short of a global phenomenon?  

    What the recent news coverage of the UAP phenomenon?  

    Has it not been groundbreaking?  

    Yes, but where is it going?  

    The inside story is that most of it is being orchestrated by our fellow avian, Hal Puthoff.  

    Small world!  

    Are we surprised or upset that Disclosure is being orchestrated?  

    Who’s in charge?  

    We are!  

    Who else?  

    God?  

    Ok, yes, it’s the best possible God.  

    And who is the best possible God?

    Don’t we know that there is that of God in every one of us?  

    So, God must be a conspiracy of our best Angels 😇.

    Would this be anathema to Religion?  

    There is a great cacophony among religions.  

    Not everyone can be right.  

    For instance, some depict a circular cosmology, while others have a linear version.

    It turns out that they are both right.

    How could that be?

    It’s not difficult to understand, if you relax on the literalism.



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    Post by dan Sat Aug 12, 2023 12:12 pm

    Elementary physics suggests a bit cheat.  

    What do a circle and a line have in common?

    They both have two distinguishing points.

    The line has two end points…….. Alpha and Omega.  

    A circle only has one point……. it’s center.  

    Not really.  

    Every closed curve, of the first degree, has two foci.  

    In the special case of the circle, the two foci are degenerate.  

    Any slight perturbation will deform the circle into an ellipse……. having two foci.

    We now have a mathematical/physical model that can translate us back and forth between the two primary cosmologies….. and interpolate between them.  

    The main clue is the identification of the Alpha and the Omega……. giving us a closed curve.

    Jesus is often taken as being just that identity, A/O.

    Thus, the wedding feast at the Omega is equivalent to our becoming one with the One at the Alpha.  

    A very flattened ellipse is equivalent to a line segment, which is now bi-directional.  

    What do we with the mystical/Hindu concept of eternal return?  

    By identifying the individual souls, we are we are allowing ourselves 10^10 circuits of the cosmic ellipse.  



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    Post by RealPan Sat Aug 12, 2023 4:21 pm

    On those occasions when the Chicken borrowed a boat, he did so get from where he was to another place, and on each occasions I eventually could see the wisdom in his actions. Wisdom and insanity can be entangled from the perspective of those with a single vantage, but with multiple vanishing points, they do separate. His actions had a purpose, and his purpose was achieved through his actions, separating the Chicken from the Loons, Crooks, and Worse.
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    Post by dan Sun Aug 13, 2023 5:41 am

    chick 🐣 will take his backhanded compliments wherever he can get them.  

    Yes, chick borrowed the boats 🛶 to get to the other side of the pond!  
    ……………  


    And, yes, chick finally discovered where all the materialists went……

    They went to Intentionalism…….. every one of them.

    It finally occurred to me, yesterday, that, if I were a materialist, I’d be pushing Intentionalism for all it was worth…….. and sure enough, that’s exactly what they were doing…… every last one of them…… https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/consciousness-intentionality/

    Yes, Intentionalism is the last refuge of the Scoundrels.  

    So, finally, we’ve got them cornered.  

    Look, I understand that they are only doing their jobs.  

    You’ve either got to be a secular or a sectarian.

    There is no sect that is going to pay a professor’s salary.  

    Yes, there are still a couple of sectarian colleges, out in the hustings, but there are no sectarian departments of philosophy.  

    So we should let the materialists have their one last playground.  

    At least, now, we know where they are, and can keep an eye 👁️ on them.  

    Such reductive intentionalism is significantly motivated by a metaphysical aim that has animated much analytic philosophy of mind: to say what mental states are in non-mentalistic, physical terms.
    This pretty much sums up the issue.  

    Reductive Intentionalism is basket 🧺 into which the materialists have been forced to put all of their eggs 🥚.  

    Yes, these Intentionalists are sensationalists, when it comes to consciousness, but then they make a strict separation between sentience and sapience.  

    But, guess what, sports fans…….. we have a problem, Huston……

    How, then, can we appeal to Darwin to get our sapient eggs 🥚 out of the frying pan 🍳?

    Where exactly is the bridge 🌉 between the sensational and the intentional?  

    Look, ma……. no bridge!!

    Is chick 🐣 the only one who sees that the Emperor has no Bridge 🌉?  

    Is this lacuna anything less than totally 💯 obvious?  

    It seems that our beloved materialists have placed themselves far out on a slender limb……. just waiting for the Katechon (scientific materialism) to implode.  

    But wait, scientific materialism is mainly based on solving the mind-body problem.

    It’s more than just the scientists who have all their eggs in one basket.  

    Maybe we all do.  

    After Intentionalism…… comes the Deluge…… chick 🐣!!

    Intentionalism is something of a tripwire…… when intentionalism goes, you know that you have about six months to open the portals…… and say your prayers!  

    The inevitable irony here is that the materialists are being led to the slaughter by an immaterialist……. just check out the bibliography of Charles Siewart…….. for instance….. “Saving Appearances: a Dilemma for Physicalists”……. hey, Charlie might as well be rooting for the chick 🐣!!  

    How about this one…….”On Getting a Good Look: Normativity and Visual Experience”…….  ?

    Or this……. “Appearance, Judgment, and Norms,” in Normativity, Meaning, and the Promise of Phenomenology…….. ?

    If I were an intentionalist at this point, I’d be waving a white flag 🏳️.  

    But, how far would you go to avoid the collapse of physicalism, and to postpone the Eschaton?  

    Really, is one article in the SEP going to trigger the collapse of scientific materialism/physicalism……. which will, in its turn, trigger the Eschaton?

    Hey, it was RAW who was looking for the cosmic trigger.

    Maybe I should call 911…… wait, I already did that…… 32 years ago!!



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    Post by dan Mon Aug 14, 2023 6:48 am

    We might think that philosophy ought to be a blood sport………. take no prisoners.  

    But, no, cooler heads prevail……… the emphasis being on civility.

    Civility keeps the outside riff-raff, like chick 🐣, from getting our muddy paws 🐾 on the chippendale.

    Philosophy folks are realizing that we, barbarians, are at the gates.

    Philosophical restraint/gentility is the order of the day.

    Battle Royal……..?  Not on our watch!  

    The rules of the game are to keep all disagreements strictly compartmentalized…….. no spillover allowed…… mama don’t allow it!!

    The secularists are able to present a united front.  

    The sectarians have a million different scripts to follow…… just by definition!  

    In academia, there are, of course, hierarchies…… and ones that exist over and above any professional mandates.

    And there will be insiders in critical, but inconspicuous locations.  

    Ok, boys and girls……… let’s keep the lid on.  

    On the surface, it’s a game of semantics.  

    But off in the corners……… thar be Monsters……. 🐣!  

    Thar be flying saucers 🛸.  

    For how long can the self-declared phenomenologists ignore the many phenomena that are going bump in the night 👻?

    For how long can they ignore the transcendental traditions?  

    For how long can they ignore the transpersonal?

    For how long can they ignore the personal?

    For how long can they ignore phenomena?  

    Yes, they will point the curious onlookers to the history of philosophy.  

    There is no currency 💴……. outside of modernism.

    But wait, where did the postmodern go?

    It went to the art departments.  

    Hey, it’s the economy, stupid!

    There is no growth in eschatology.  

    Well, hold your breath, and run around the house without thinking of consciousness………

    Science has given us an objective world……. but, as the phenomenologists are wont to point out…… there can be no objects without subjects.  

    You might think that someone would have the temerity to make a federal case out of this…….. to call 911……. 🐣.    

    We know who we can blame for all of this………. Charlie D.

    Yes, he’s dead……. but he’s gone to seed…… everywhere……. as some aggressively invasive species.

    It must have been a setup……. a cosmic setup…… and it will take a cosmic trigger…….

    In the meantime, we have been mesmerized by the idea of technology and unlimited growth.

    And hasn’t Mt Everest existed since long before we, subjects, hit the scene.

    Well, that’s the problem with objects.

    They require definition.

    This is the radical claim of us, immaterialists……..

    We define the world.

    We are the ones who can ask why…….. anything!

    How long can the phenomenologists avoid the metaphysical ultimacy of………. phenomena?



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    Post by dan Mon Aug 14, 2023 9:52 am

    Yes, when faced with anything that is tinged with the ultimate, the reflex response amongst the modernists is containment by compartmentalization.  

    In the case consciousness, the compartments du-jour are qualia, on the one hand, and intentionality for the rest.  

    This is a clever move……… divide and conquer.  

    Basically, we’re dividing the opposition into the sentients and the sapients.  

    We’re known as the Separatists.

    We demote qualia down to the level of mere sentients.  

    Nobody’s going to make a federal case on behalf of the rats 🐀.

    Then we’re just left with intentionality.  

    Questions of intentionality can be reduced to questions of functionality.  

    Functions………. we all know that machines have functions……

    So there we are……… we all are glorified machines……. about to be supplanted by the ChatGPTs.  

    That’ll put us in our place…….. six feet under……. R.I.P.!  

    End of story……..

    That will be the Metanarrative to end all narratives!  

    The philosophers thought they could while away their days in their ivy covered cubicles.  

    It’s looking like the chickens are coming home to roost……. 🐣!

    Sure, it’s easy to say that only sapients can prescribe functions.

    But, with AI in the ascendant, the machines have become the programmers.



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    Post by RealPan Mon Aug 14, 2023 8:37 pm

    The Canary is entangled, on the way to Spain. It tried to reach Morocco, but it fell asleep in Spain. At home it was content, but it could not recall home. So the Canara swam its way all the way back again.
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    Post by dan Tue Aug 15, 2023 8:34 am

    The poor forgetful chick 🐣!

    So near, yet so far…….
    …………..




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    Post by RealPan Tue Aug 15, 2023 6:19 pm

    Gregor does not forget so easily, entangled as he is with the Swede. What are they looking for?
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    Post by dan Tue Aug 15, 2023 8:11 pm

    Pan,

    You tell us.
    …………..



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