The Bible, UFOs, ET and the Ancients Part 3

First topic message reminder :

Hi ScarZ,

Thank you for posting this information. Does any of David Flynn's material give any idea to the time-frames for the early events or historical figures that his research indicated?

Genetically Modified Humans? New Gene-Altering Drug Paves Way for Mass Modification

http://naturalsociety.com/genetically-modified-humans-gene-altering-drug-mass-modification/

While the drug is only meant to be given to 1 or 2 out of every million people, it paves way for further experimentation into the field of biotechnology and human alteration. Soon, doctors may be giving out drugs to treat any ‘defects’ in genes, whether it be for the so-called ‘fat’ gene or another instance where a damaged gene is present. It could even apply to purported ‘criminal’ genes that are said to predict an individual’s future ‘life of crime’. It may sound crazy, but scientists are already making even more serious moves that will alter or ‘create’ humankind.

Scarz

Ok - I'm trying to understand your p.o.v. I'm thinking in my head and conveying it here:

He believes the watchers and their offspring are here today. ‘As was in the days of Noah.’

He believes they are genetically tinkering with man again - in various ways?

He believes the Eve’s of old who were ‘Traditionally Given’ into marriage had a choice and the power to resist an angel who would have been greater than a king? When did kings ever
ask for anything? Didn’t they take?

Does he then believe UFO's are actual physical craft and that our Gov. is trying to wrestle technology away from angels? Does he believe we have some angelic technology in bases out west?

Then he believes in UFOs are actually craft!?

What does he think about 3000 ells?

Those Grey beings certainly cannot qualify as 'giants'. If their offspring were 'giants' in antiquity how can we compare the four fingered space gnomes to them? For all intent and purposes – most descriptions of them are ‘sickly’ looking and as if they can barely ambulate. Those are the ‘giants’ of old?

Merely ruminating.

@MD02

To be honest I really know very little of your beliefs on anything. I don't even know if you believe in God. I at least don't mind laying my beliefs on the table.


To be totally up front with you,you haven't got my beliefs down very good at all. You may be close in some areas,but pretty far off on others.

I have written time and time again I've never had any encounters with UFO's,Aliens,any off planet cultures,or what ever people choose to call them in my life that I have knowledge of. I mention over and over when I lay out my thoughts......"If there are others out there." I'm only talking about UFO's with aliens in the mix,not angels. Most certainly I believe something is going on,but what exactly?...."I'm not a 100% sure,and I don't believe anyone is."

I give my thoughts,beliefs and opinions on the subject and attempt to lay out some information...."Why I think or believe as I do." That's it plain and simple. I have never once said this is it and it can't be anything else.

To be honest I believe very little of the UFO material is anything more than BS. Most are fakes,scams and total BS in my opinion.

I also post a lot of links to others material that interest me. Does that mean I agree with them completely...."No it doesn't."

Tom Horn,Steve Quayle,David Flynn,Peter Goodgame,and Michael Heiser are just a few I enjoy reading,watching,or listening to. Out of just those five I would say Peter Goodgame,Michael Heiser,and the late David Flynn have influenced me more than anyone else in my over all beliefs. I'm not talking about The Father,The Son,The Holy Spirit,or The Bible,just plain ole humans as I am.


As far as the 3000 ells question,I've posted on this in the past. I really saw no need laying it out again when Jake answered your question. Some of it was along the same line of thinking. I just felt I could add little to the conversation.


I have never said I believe grey's are "Giants". I certainly believe they "Could be" hybrids. All hybrids are not large-tall giants.

I certainly have never said all the hybrids in the days before or after the flood were "Giants"....."Many were." When I'm saying giants,I'm talking large-tall giants here....."Not just the mixing of genetics and corruption in the bloodline."


*******************

What do you (MD02) believe on the subject of UFO'S-Aliens?

Will reply sometime later tonight.
Time is short here.

ScaRZ last post without the term " cookie cutter creation" ???

Anyway, MD- I too thought Jake more then explained the the 3000 ells.. Thank you Jake.

As far as the recent Part 6 Are they involved..

The fact that the majority of the abduction aspect takes place at night brings up plenty of questions. Personally if it's all really happening as the 3 + % report then I simply have to ask why at night. Our park rangers etc don't do their animal tagging in stealth of night (for the most part) .. Maybe that's all this is - a tag and record keeping study by the martians.

Hmmm- na that's not it...

ScaRZ wrote:
I don't even know if you believe in God.

I do believe in a creator of all things. I am sure he/she has many names in many locations throughout the universe/multiverse

"If there are others out there." I'm only talking about UFO's with aliens in the mix, not angels. Most certainly I believe something is going on, but what exactly?...."I'm not a 100% sure, and I don't believe anyone is."

We agree. I have not ruled out any scenario.

To be honest I believe very little of the UFO material is anything more than BS. Most are fakes, scams and total BS in my opinion.


We basically agree. Still, I believe it is unfair to judge those who relate encounters, spiritual included.

I fail to understand why you get so hostile in the exchanges during discussion with 'people just don't get it' moments. Also, what sort of conversation would take place if everyone was in agreement, especially on these issues? Sometimes I play the devil’s advocate in the absence of another to try to learn others perspectives.

Tom Horn,Steve Quayle,David Flynn,Peter Goodgame,and Michael Heiser are just a few I enjoy reading,watching,or listening to. Out of just those five I would say Peter Goodgame,Michael Heiser,and the late David Flynn have influenced me more than anyone else in my over all beliefs. I'm not talking about The Father,The Son,The Holy Spirit,or The Bible,just plain ole humans as I am.


I came to this conclusion long ago, but thank you for illustrating it more. I do enjoy Michael from time to time as well.

What do you (MD02) believe on the subject of UFO'S-Aliens?

Regarding the A in Alien:
Honestly....I believe there must be a constant analysis of ALL disciplines of thought Not just one perspective. Religious, theological, sociopolitical, philosophical, futurism, anthropological, and all the other three dollar words academia would attach to what could be a boon or a bust to life as we know it. “IF” (BIG IF)

I also know, I know nothing about this entire shebang despite countless hours of intensive exploration, much like you stated. Attaining knowledge in any subject matter only leads one to question it into a greater significance.

For me to disbelieve everyone claiming they have had an Alien/’whatever’ experiences would naturally predispose me to disbelieve every supernatural occurrence within the bible that were‘experienced’ but not verifiable. This would be unwise and counterintuitive. I do err on the side of caution and attempt to have a neutral perspective, most times. Skeptical inquiry does have its merits unless they become destructive to its ends.

Jake posed some thoughts previously on the “whatevers’” being us from 50,000 years in the future. Not that I believe it to be a fact, but consider its implications as it being truth for a moment and look into the world today. We are already dead!! If we are already dead – do time travelers (us – bug eyed space gnomes) have an ethical right to take DNA/genetic material from us to save our dying species in the future? Sounds like a good plot for those in the business of stealing ideas for Hollywood though.

I do consider us all friends here despite the jostling from time to time – for the record.

@MD02

Thank you for giving some of your thoughts,beliefs,and opinions.

I'm not judging anyone...."I'm giving my opinions." I'm a very strongly opinionated person and I've been that way all my life. I will not be a fake and attempt to be someone I'm not. I'm not trying to please anyone with my responses.

When you use the term hostile,I don't view myself as a hostile person. I know I will jab most of the time when others jab at me. Some days I will let things go,but most I will not. I'm not going to let anyone run over me.

I've been at this for many years and have encountered all types of people. A few words from them and I pretty much have a good read where the conversation is going.

I know I'm not sugar and spice and everything nice,but neither is anyone else,no matter what they may or may not believe or follow. I know what I see when looking in the mirror. I'm a human with many blemishes.


I also consider us friends here despite the jostling from time to time. I want people to get to know me for who I am,not who or what they expect or want me to be.

Nib wrote:ScaRZ last post without the term " cookie cutter creation" ???

"cookie cutter creation","cookie cutter creation".......How do you like them apples?

Ask and you shall receive.

Nice short but sweet interview with Michael Heiser. His take on UFO'S and Aliens. We were just talking about that subject and he weighs in.

----------------------------------

UFologist Michael Heiser not convinced aliens have visited Earth

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/2013/01/20/2843251/ufologist-michael-heiser-not-convinced.html

By MICHELLE NOLAN — FOR THE BELLINGHAM HERALD



Michael Heiser has been called one of the nation's leading experts on "UFology" - the study of unidentified flying objects - yet he says he has never seen any scientific evidence that they are visitors from other worlds.

Heiser, 49, has released a special edition of his novel, "The Façade," which combines factual data with a plot about mysterious visitors. The academic editor for Logos Bible Software in Bellingham, he holds a doctorate from the University of Wisconsin in Hebrew, biblical and Semitic languages.

Question: You've been on radio quite often, haven't you?

Answer: I've spoken 22 times on "Coast to Coast AM" (a nationally syndicated night-time show heard locally on KGMI). I've become the friendly "ancient astronaut debunking guy."

I self-published the first version of "The Façade" for fun in 2001. I've sold 5,000 to 6,000 copies. You could call me "nerd famous."

Q: Tell me about "The Façade."

A: The novel asks the fundamental question: What would the impact be on traditional Judeo-Christian faith if there was a genuine extraterrestrial reality?

Q: What makes your new version "The Façade: Special Edition" different?

A: It's published by Kirkdale Press, a Logos imprint. There's an annotated bibliography related to plot elements, along with a list of all the fact-based data points: ancient texts, government documents, quotations by public officials, exotic technologies.

The fiction is the characters and how I connect the data points. The book also includes the first five chapters of the first sequel. I'm one-third finished. I also plan a third book.

Q: What is the main protagonist like?

A: The main character, Brian Scott, is essentially (a younger version of) me. I named him for my best friend at high school in Pennsylvania. Against their will, Brian and other members of a group of academics get pulled into a government project. Brian is sort of transformed into Agent Mulder (from "The X-Files"), with a doctorate in ancient languages.

Q: Are there aliens in the story?

A: I don't really want to give anything away. Gradually, Brian and the other members of the project begin to wonder if there really is an ET reality, or could it be something else? Could it be a visitor from a spiritual dimension?

The characters also become involved in another possibility: Could a strange being (to which they are exposed) actually be a "nanobot" - a functioning, conscious being that is not human?

Q: Is bringing in your factual research difficult?

A: It takes a lot of work, but I think it's worth it. I try to bring in peer-reviewed research and primary source documents.

Q: Do you see a conflict between Judeo-Christian faith and whether aliens could exist?

A: I don't see anything in the Bible that forbids it.

Q: Do you believe some UFOs could be from other worlds?

A: I don't think we've seen any really good evidence. I want something better than anecdotes. There's been no real credible evidence that aliens visited ancient civilizations or helped built the pyramids, things like that. The "evidence" is impressive only to people who are not specialists in those fields.

In my book, I talk about experimental wingless aircraft (dating back several decades). I think a lot of what can't be identified is off-the-books, black-budget human technology.

Q: Do you believe alien beings exist but are too far away to reach with any known technology?

A: It feels like the odds are in favor of that. But I don't believe in the Drake Equation (which supposedly offers proof). Every element of the Drake Equation is invented.

I think the Biggest News of import is the American Presidential Inauguration declaring homosexuality to be equal to natural sexuality, as a Statute of American Law. The Presidential Inauguration Planners, further arranged for this declaration to be confirmed in the closing prayer, as a new American moral edict, before God.

The President of the United States addressing the entire nation, encouraged his accompanying daughters to become lesbians, if they want. And implored the nation to morally agree. From here on, public condemnation – or even public criticism – of that behavior will be considered morally wrong.

"Our journey is not complete until our gay brothers and sisters are treated like anyone else under the law -- for if we are truly created equal, then surely the love we commit to one another must be equal as well."

The love that gay men commit toward one another, and lesbian women commit toward one another, is formally declared by the U.S. President to be considered equal to the love that a husband and wife commit to one another.


------------

The Presidential Office of the United States of America has declared War on natural law and world-wide religious moral law.

Watch and see what happens now! It's only a matter of time.
The US President has awakened the Sleeping Dragon in the East and aroused the condemnation of Gog/Magog. And spat in the face of Islam.

The seeds of Global War are now planted.

The Providential Passing of David Flynn

By Jay A member at David Flynn's Watcher Forum

http://watchermeetup.50.forumer.com/the-providential-passing-of-david-flynn-t1271654.html


In honor of the one year anniversary of David's passing, I thought I would share this interesting finding with you – as well I might say in honor of our Providential Father, both Creator of the Earth and heavens, and Ruler over all life's events, including the timing of our departure from this Earth, as well the timing of the departure of our loved ones. While we may doubt the Father's Providence when considering the pain of losing a loved one, we can rest assured that He knows what He's doing. Most of the time we must take this by faith, though, seeing through a glass darkly.

But what about when the curtain is momentarily pulled back and the LORD shows us His ways, His acts, His reasons? We can surely rejoice at the exceeding grace of such revelations, when He is pleased to give them. And so I believe it is here. On this anniversary of his death I would like to share what the LORD has revealed to me about the timing of David's passing, and may the Father be glorified for it.

But first I need to establish some background information...

Much of David's work centered on revealing what God had revealed to him about the secrets of the celestial sphere; the fact that the heavens have an orderly, clock-like function to them (and the intriguing prophetic implications), as decribed in Genesis 1:14,

And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

In other words, the stars tell time.

This really is a vast subject, and not my intent to cover it thoroughly, so let's briefly take a closer look at one aspect of that, in order to set up for what we're looking at.

Just like our day is divided into 24 hours, so the heavens are divided in 24 "hours", going east-west, like lines of longitude. In other words, if longitude on Earth was divided in 24 main segments ("hours"), this would be analogous to how the "longitude" of the heavens is divided. But instead of calling it "longitude" astronomers call it right ascension. This is how astronomers measure the location of celestial bodies (east-west measurements). And just like our 24 hours are divided up into hours, minutes, and seconds as units of measure, so is right ascension. So therefore just like we use clock measurements to tell the time of day, astronomers therefore use clock measurements to tell the position of an heavenly body (again, east-west measurements).

The Sun rises at a different "longitude", or right ascension, every morning on its way around the 360° of the heavens throughout the course of the year (an optical illusion produced, of course, because of the movement of the Earth around the Sun). Therefore each morning sees the Sun rising at a different hour/minute/second configuration, starting with "Zero Hour" at the Vernal Equinox.



As you can see from the picture, at around March 20 (Vernal Equinox) the Sun rises at a place which astronomers have determined is "Zero Hour", a.k.a. PRIME MERIDIAN OF THE HEAVENS (since the PM marks the "Zero Hour" on Earth as well).

Then, every day after that the Sun rises at a different hour/minute/second configuration, as mentioned. Since there are 24 "hours" of longitude, or right ascension, to get through in one year, but only 12 months, therefore the Sun goes through 2 hours per month, or roughly 1 hour every 15 days.

Since "Zero Hour", or "Prime Meridian", or "Midnight" aligns with the Vernal Equinox, and there are 4 Solstices and Equinoxes in a year, and there are 24 hours of longitude in a year to get through, and 24 divided by 4 is 6, therefore the Solstices and Equinoxes align with every 6th hour of the "Clock of the Heavens" (and therefore the Sun aligns with these points as well).

VERNAL EQUINOX = 0 HOUR
SUMMER SOLSTICE = 6th HOUR
AUTUMNAL EQUINOX = 12th HOUR
WINTER SOLSTICE = 18th HOUR

As you can imagine this brings to mind questions like "I wonder what the 'celestial time' was when such-'n-such event happened". Naturally, therefore, I also began to wonder where the Sun was on the "Clock of the Heavens" when David passed into eternal rest. Remember again the Sun rises at a different place every day on this clock. I loaded up the free program Stellarium and checked out the position (right ascension; RA) of the Sun on the morning of 1/22/12.



The Sun rose at the once-a-year, unique signature of 20h 16m on the morning of David's last day on Earth! Those who know David's work know how the year 2016 became a focal point of his work. Not only that but the previous day, the last full day of David's life, saw the Sun at 20h 12m on the "Clock of the Heavens"!



2012 – again a number central to David's work, and probably more so than 2016 – defined his last full day on Earth. Not only that but the latitude of the heavens, or declination (DE), transitioned from -19° 48m to -19° 47m as the morning of 1/22/12 started! 1947 and 1948 also need no explanation to anyone who follows David's work.



This is all, of course, no accident. Out of all the days during the year David could have gone to glory, the Father took him on a day which was defined by the very numbers that took center stage in his life: 2016, 2012, 1948, 1947. David's passing went exactly according to the Divine Plan, according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will (Eph. 1:11). Let us all give thanks and praise to the Father for His amazing and gracious Providence!

ScaRZ wrote:
This is all, of course, no accident. Out of all the days during the year David could have gone to glory, the Father took him on a day which was defined by the very numbers that took center stage in his life: 2016, 2012, 1948, 1947. David's passing went exactly according to the Divine Plan, according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will (Eph. 1:11). Let us all give thanks and praise to the Father for His amazing and gracious Providence!

To Jay,
A member at David Flynn's Watcher Forum

Yes, yes Jay... a large memorial stone monument for David and his work, should be erected for the edification of future generations. David should be declared a Saint, a Prophet sent by God himself. And his books should be added to the Biblical Canon.

-----------------------


edit: Joking of course!
I see the 'time' of my post isn't aligned with the heavens.

Wait - 4:38 on 1/22/2013, written @ 43.080°N 79.071°W. Hmmm!? Perhaps if I work on it....

ScaRZ wrote:Nice short but sweet interview with Michael Heiser. His take on UFO'S and Aliens. We were just talking about that subject and he weighs in.

----------------------------------

UFologist Michael Heiser not convinced aliens have visited Earth

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/2013/01/20/2843251/ufologist-michael-heiser-not-convinced.html

By MICHELLE NOLAN — FOR THE BELLINGHAM HERALD

Yes, short and sweet. I can generally agree with his over view. Would have liked to see more questions.

I will say that he walks a fine line, though. As there is more evidence and witness testimony of Alien visitation, than Jesus' visitation. On which grounds, mainstream Ufology may use to ridicule him. But Michael has a worthy place in this field, none the less.

Thanks for sharing this, ScaRZ

I need to make a confession:

I am a bit disturbed by Kevin Bacon staring at me!

MD02 wrote:I need to make a confession:

I am a bit disturbed by Kevin Bacon staring at me!

ha,, could be this guy~ instead, ya just never know...




heh.. Hey Jake that joke, ummm I laughed but yea you should work on it a bit..

Must say that David's passing and correlation numerically described is ever so Apropos considering his work! God Bless his soul!!

ScaRZ wrote:I have never said The Book of Enoch was on par with the holy scriptures of The Bible. I do believe however that it as well as some other ancient text do hold information that can hold value.

Jake you were the first one to drop The Book of Enoch in this latest conversation.

I have always felt you and I saw The Book of Enoch in the same way, ScaRZ. I think it was you who brought it to my attention years ago on the original forum. Yes, I dropped it in this conversation because it was talked about by Nib and MD, so I thought it apropos to use as an object lesson.

Nib,
Thanks for your shout-out on the "Giant" posts. It spurred me to look further into scholarly reviews. You were the catalyst in furthering my learning.

Glad you laughed at my comments to "Jay" (re: David Flynn) Ya, I meant no direct disrespect toward David. I know he's our Bro. Only that "Jay" s-t-r-e-t-c-h-e-d a tad too far.

Kevin Bacon..... He's one of my favs' as well. In my top 50 male Hollywood actors. For an actor Avatar, I see B-ScaRZ more like Braveheart, Mel.

Oh and I forgot one addition to my controversial post that is no longer morally correct to speak about.... Your US President has declared war against Christianity world-wide, as well. He has given permission to all peoples in all Countries who host US Christian Missionaries, to shun and ridicule them in their countries, as suspected agents of moral corruption.

Innocent blood will be shed.

I am sorry for you all.

However, I will never be sorry for stating such.

Watch and see what happens.

MD02 wrote:I need to make a confession:

I am a bit disturbed by Kevin Bacon staring at me!

Kevin Bacon is one of my favorite actors and his new show "The Following" began Monday night. I watched it and thought it was a very good show. One of the best TV shows I've watched since "24" and "Lost". I enjoy shows that keep you guessing what's around the next corner. Most TV shows are just boring and I already know how it will begin,how all the middle will fall together,as well as the ending.

Jake Reason wrote:
Kevin Bacon..... He's one of my favs' as well. In my top 50 male Hollywood actors. For an actor Avatar, I see B-ScaRZ more like Braveheart, Mel.

Oh and I forgot one addition to my controversial post that is no longer morally correct to speak about.... Your US President has declared war against Christianity world-wide, as well. He has given permission to all peoples in all Countries who host US Christian Missionaries, to shun and ridicule them in their countries, as suspected agents of moral corruption.

Innocent blood will be shed.

I am sorry for you all.

However, I will never be sorry for stating such.

Watch and see what happens.

"Braveheart", I have it in my collection....."Great movie". My all time favorite still remains "Apocalypse Now".

So you Jake see me as the "Warrior". When I think of great warriors in The Bible,the first three that I think of are Joshua,Caleb,and Michael The Archangel.


Your controversial post I read yesterday,but decided I would stay out of it. I'm not afraid to voice my opinion,but wanted others to give their thoughts. I see nobody stepped forward.


Isn't innocent blood always shed?

I feel sorrow for this whole world.

I'm also not sorry for stating things I stand firm on.

Every single moment we need to all be watching.

[quote="Jake Reason"]

ScaRZ wrote:



Nib,
Thanks for your shout-out on the "Giant" posts. It spurred me to look further into scholarly reviews. You were the catalyst in furthering my learning.

-----------
Kevin Bacon..... He's one of my favs' as well. In my top 50 male Hollywood actors.

It's all been an enjoyable conversation from my POV. The day we all turn our computer off and put down the bible and other texts and say, " ok I've figured it all out" is likely going to be a day we should be inducted into the hall of ignorant fools...

And yes Kevin is great from stir of echoes to the tiny bit he did in planes trains and Automobiles..


Now as far as Jakes controversial posts well I thought that speech was absurd. However I gotta say I don't quite get what Jake is saying here: ?

Oh and I forgot one addition to my controversial post that is no longer morally correct to speak about.... Your US President has declared war against Christianity world-wide, as well. He has given permission to all peoples in all Countries who host US Christian Missionaries, to shun and ridicule them in their countries, as suspected agents of moral corruption.

Jake you simply have to clarify why and how you came to this observation?

Nib wrote: The day we all turn our computer off and put down the bible and other texts and say, " ok I've figured it all out" is likely going to be a day we should be inducted into the hall of ignorant fools...

Two Thumbs Way Up!!

Nib wrote:
Now as far as Jakes controversial posts well I thought that speech was absurd. However I gotta say I don't quite get what Jake is saying here: ?

Oh and I forgot one addition to my controversial post that is no longer morally correct to speak about.... Your US President has declared war against Christianity world-wide, as well. He has given permission to all peoples in all Countries who host US Christian Missionaries, to shun and ridicule them in their countries, as suspected agents of moral corruption.

Jake you simply have to clarify why and how you came to this observation?

Sure Nib.

I am curious though...do you understand my preliminary observations, here?

What I posted there, would be easily understood by the vast majority of the world's 7 billion people. All they might query about is my conclusions - Sleeping Dragon, God/Magog, Islam, Global War.

However, Americans will be among the least able to understand and/or accept. Along with a minority portion of other modern countries. But even in these countries, greater than half of their populations will also understand my preliminary post, while mostly refraining from speaking about it for fear of ridicule. And most of these would also deny they fear any ridicule, as to admit their inner truth could subject them to other ridicule.

As for the rest of the world, most would wonder why anyone would need to ask.

With that intro, which includes part of the answer, I'll try to explain the 'missionary' portion...

1. You have likely heard from world travelers, that America is not viewed by the world as most Americans think it is viewed. This is very true and commonly known outside of America. But most Americans do not understand how they are viewed, until they travel abroad and socialize with locals. Resort travel can't provide this experience.

2. America is among the freest countries in the world. And the rest of the world would agree. However Americans for the most part, do not understand how life is experienced in other countries. And how lessor freedoms are the norm. And lessor abundance is the norm. Lessor privilege is the norm. And most importantly, they know no other experience.

3. The world admires America, in which Americans have great pride. However the world also fears America. This fear is shared not only by other country's people, but also their Political leaders. Some Americans also pride themselves in this as well. However most Americans do not understand why the world fears them.

4. The vast majority of the world's population live life in a social-political paradigm that forbids them to accept homosexuality as normal or equal to heterosexuality. Their societies are this way, not because of propagated edict or law, but because they naturally think this way. Their social-political construct reflect their inner views.

5. In third world countries, this is virtually unanimous. Capital punishment for homosexuality is commonly accepted in 3rd world countries. Some country's authorities even tolerate their villagers to carry it out, by Elder cree. Imprisonment for homosexuality is widely accepted with virtually no public resistance to the contrary. Homosexuals must live in secrecy for fear of their lives. Needless to summarize, homosexuality is considered abhorrent. And this is life for approx two billion people, give or take.

6. In second world countries, such as Latin America for example, homosexuality is condemned by their religions. And virtually all of them are brought up in religious schools. For the most part, but not entirely, the practice of capital punishment for homosexuality is no longer tolerated in their major cities. And imprisonment for homosexuality is virtually nil in their major cities. But it still occurs in some portions of their vast rural areas, where laws are still adapted and generally enforced by local public opinion.

7. The 1st world countries also do not collectively agree with America's view. Russian countries are currently in the midst of legislating laws to abolish pro-homosexual propaganda. Google Putin. Australia's Prime Minister is currently fighting to strike down gay marriage. And most 1st world countries have also not permitted it.

But 1st world countries are not a US Missionary problem. As virtually all modern countries have already established extensive Church representation. The biggest problem is the majority of the world noted in 4-6 above. In these countries, US Missionaries are at risk and are on alert.

8. con't..
I have to step out for awhile



edit grammar

Jake Reason wrote:I think the Biggest News of import is the American Presidential Inauguration declaring homosexuality to be equal to natural sexuality, as a Statute of American Law. The Presidential Inauguration Planners, further arranged for this declaration to be confirmed in the closing prayer, as a new American moral edict, before God.

The President of the United States addressing the entire nation, encouraged his accompanying daughters to become lesbians, if they want. And implored the nation to morally agree. From here on, public condemnation – or even public criticism – of that behavior will be considered morally wrong.

"Our journey is not complete until our gay brothers and sisters are treated like anyone else under the law -- for if we are truly created equal, then surely the love we commit to one another must be equal as well."

The love that gay men commit toward one another, and lesbian women commit toward one another, is formally declared by the U.S. President to be considered equal to the love that a husband and wife commit to one another.


------------

The Presidential Office of the United States of America has declared War on natural law and world-wide religious moral law.

Watch and see what happens now! It's only a matter of time.
The US President has awakened the Sleeping Dragon in the East and aroused the condemnation of Gog/Magog. And spat in the face of Islam.

The seeds of Global War are now planted.

I understood this post. And agree with the assessment. The root of why they're doing this is "population stabilization" and "societal stability", or so they believe. And they intend to force all of this not only on America but on the world. IN SO DOING IT on America they prove it valid upon the rest of the world for what America represents to the rest of the world.

See my latest post in Dan's thread, unfortunately I was unable to transfer the whole of the convo I had this morning at another site via chat...and probably should not. But I left a small sample.

Sure Nib.

I am curious though...do you understand my preliminary observations, here?

What I posted there, would be easily understood by the vast majority of the world's 7 billion people. All they might query about, is my conclusions - Sleeping Dragon, God/Magog, Islam, Global War.

However, Americans will be among the least able to understand and/or accept. Along with a minority portion of other modern countries. But even in these countries, greater than half of their populations will also easily understand my preliminary post, while mostly refraining from speaking about it for fear of ridicule. And most of these would also deny they fear any ridicule, as to admit their inner truth could subject them to other ridicule.

As for the rest of the world, most would wonder why anyone would need to ask.

With that intro, which includes part of the answer, I'll try to explain the 'missionary' portion...

1. You have likely heard from world travelers, that America is not viewed by the world as most Americans think it is viewed. This is very true and commonly known outside of America. But most Americans do not understand how they are viewed, until they travel abroad and socialize with locals. Resort travel can't provide this experience.

2. America is among the freest countries in the world. And the rest of the world would agree. However Americans for the most part, do not understand how life is experienced in other countries. And how lessor freedoms are the norm. And lessor abundance is the norm. Lessor privilege is the norm. And most importantly, they know no other experience.

3. The world admires America, in which Americans have great pride. However the world also fears America. This fear is shared not only by other country's people, but also their Political leaders. Some Americans also pride themselves in this as well. However most Americans do not understand why the world fears them.

4. The vast majority of the world's population live life in a social-political paradigm that forbids them to accept homosexuality as normal or equal to heterosexuality. Their societies are this way, not because of propagated edict or law, but because they naturally think this way. Their social-political construct reflect their inner views.

5. con't

correct.

http://forum.grasscity.com/politics/1013019-christians-syria.html

http://www.whitenewsnow.com/german-white-news-und-auf-deutsch/35070-homeschoolers-flee-persecution-germany-sweden.html

http://global.christianpost.com/news/christians-in-egypt-endure-crucifixions-more-blood-will-be-shed-says-expert-80301/
Christians in Egypt Endure Crucifixions: 'More Blood Will Be Shed,' Says Expert
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2012/08/17/report-muslim-brotherhood-crucifies-opponents-clamps-down-on-secular-media/
Shock Report: Muslim Brotherhood ‘Crucifies’ Opponents on Trees in Front of Presidential Palace | TheBlaze.com
http://www.speroforum.com/a/TGYMVZXKXF17/73034-Iraqi-Muslim-terror-Christian-children-crucified
Iraqi Muslim terror: Christian children crucified
http://www.wnd.com/2012/08/arab-spring-run-amok-brotherhood-starts-crucifixions/
Arab Spring run amok: ‘Brotherhood’ starts crucifixions
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2004/04/sudanese-christian-slave-crucified-by-muslim-master.html
Sudanese Christian slave 'crucified' by Muslim master - Jihad Watch

I would say there are Americans who don't get it. Many get it but are afraid to look at it. I think most hope it will just somehow,someway stay at arms length.

It's too bad the whole world views Americans through the words and actions of one person. There are a lot of good people in this USA. We aren't the devils many paint us to be.

Thank you Cyrellys. And for the links concerning missionary persecution. I can shorten my continued explanation.

ScaRZ,
Yes, America is inherently good. Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton said today at the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on Capital Hill:

"America is the most extraordinary force for peace and progress the world has ever known."

I wholeheartedly agree!

more on that to follow...

Jake Reason wrote:
But 1st world countries are not a US Missionary problem. As virtually all modern countries have already established extensive Church representation. The biggest problem is the majority of the world noted in 4-6 above. In these countries, US Missionaries are at risk and are on alert.

8. con't..

8. These countries (4-6 above) for the most part do not understand American politics. They can't relate to it. They don't understand that the President of the USA can say things that are not automatically implied to be American Law, Moral Edicts, Diplomatic and/or US Foreign policy. In their countries when they hear their Leaders say things, they are under the impression that they are being informed of the Government's Official position and obliged to comply, or face consequences.

9. The American President is the Commander and Chief of the world's largest, most technologically advanced and most powerful Military machine, demonstrably capable of obliterating an entire country within weeks. The people of 3rd world countries know this all too well. And so whatever the President of the USA says, ESPECIALLY at the Inauguration, much of the 2nd and 3rd world's people believe that what he said, will likely be coming to their country and obligated upon them. And fearfully, potentially enforced in the future.

10. Many of them will think that US Missionaries in their countries will also be obliged to teach Christianity as the US President has implied it should.

And so in summary I return to my original statement:

"Your US President has declared war against Christianity world-wide, as well. He has given permission to all peoples in all Countries who host US Christian Missionaries, to shun and ridicule them in their countries, as suspected agents of moral corruption."


-------------------------

Back to Hillary Clinton today....

She was testifying at the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, to answer questions and accusations concerning irresponsible handling of security in Benghazi, Libya, that led to the death of four American Diplomatic staff.

The accusations are considered serious, as they imply that the deaths were caused by failures in security and Foreign Embassy oversight. In other words... The Presidential Office of the United Sates is responsible for their deaths.

The US President is fully aware of these hearings and their lead-up. Yet just two days ago, The Commander and Chief, by decree, put 10s of thousands of US Missionaries at increased risk of brutal persecution, and into a state of extreme cause for duress, at the least.

This was reprehensibly irresponsible of him, by any measure. He further shames America and the Presidency by declaring such things, as if speaking on behalf of all Americans, as representative of America to the whole world.

In sympathy, America is entitled to its internal social engineering experiments and transitions. However what the US President has now done, crosses the line into a grey twilight, harbingering suicidal insanity. Not merely for he and his family, but bringing it upon America as a whole.

There will be much innocent blood shed, as the world has its say. All races, all nations, creeds and tongues, will be weighing in.


Now the dominoes tumble... Watch and see what happens.
This is a global historical turning point.



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