Immaterialism 4

First topic message reminder :

This is the continuation of the Immaterialism 3 thread.......

The original topic reminder post https://openmindsforum.forumotion.com/t320-immaterialism
should be substituted here......

............

Thank you, Gary, for the Kastrup article.  Even the academics are beginning to connect the dots.  


CC,

And even Tom DeLonge does not want to get left behind, it seems.  


Doug wants to remind us that when you go to the other side, typically you take on a new identity.  You may even take on multiple identities....... memories can be retained.  


And, as hobbit points out, times and locations may take on a transgeometric identity...... on the other side.  It is much more dreamlike....... even just thoughtlike.  Yes, the BPW is much more like a great thought than a great machine.  

So why geometry........?  The level playing field helps us to not get our game pieces too mixed up.  It enables the Metanarrative to play itself out...... in a linear/sequential fashion.  

The other side takes on quantumlike aspects........ much superposition....... entanglement.  


Hopefully, smelly will be mostly correct, and Disclosure will mostly just be disclosure....... as we keep tripping through these tulips.  

What about the three musketeers......?  Maybe we won’t have to hurry out of Dodge...... we can loiter a bit.  

It’s Newton and Darwin who may ride out on a rail.  Their absolutism/literalism will be seen as highly parochial..... almost quaint...... downright nostalgic.  

We speak blithely of postmodernism...... we ain’t seen nothin’, yet.  

Disclosure was fun while it lasted. It’s all over....... even the shouting. Now, it’s just a question of getting down to the nitty gritty of the BPW. The devil will be in the details.

What will smelly do now? He may not have chicken little to kick around, anymore. I may be able to give up the Ghost...... the holy one. Yes, sports fans, this was the hg...... very lite. You are allowed to breathe a sigh of relief.



(cont........)

Could I just suggest to the spinny machine people that it is not the spinny machine, but what the spinny machine is spinning.

If instead You induced the stuff to spin without any machine spinning, then You may better comprehend grebennikov, and TTB.

The universe is fixed, a geometric perfectly packed crystal, it's just a jump to the left.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umj0gu5nEGs








hobbit

Has anyone ever wondered where a seashell obtains the material to make it's shell comes from?
http://www.spirasolaris.ca/sbb4d2cs.html

Or where a tree gets the wood to make itself from?

What if it spins into 3D existence from seemingly nowhere?

But what is spinning from nowhere?

Where did You come from?

hobbit

hobbit,

Clearly, Grebennikov was ahead of his time, with his Hive power.  

Yes, that’s what everyone is saying....... the portal is just a jump to the left.

And, yes, Spirasolaris is what physics will look like, when we turn the world inside out.


4:30(gmt-4)............

We are in the process of hammering out an historic agreement between Paul P, Joe F and Frank C concerning the successive structuring of the Council.  Do stay tuned........ you won’t want to miss it.  


hobbit,

Where did I come from.......?

A little bit to the left of where you came from........ no doubt.



(cont.......)

All the best rooms are on the left.
http://www.folds.net/Tolkien/hobbit_hole_definition.html

Ever wondered how moles know where they are?

Hobbit

How?

Or...... how does anyone know where anyone is?

For Jung, as for the alchemists, the actual structure of the psyche is plural, even though its ultimate goal may be unity. The multiple luminosities of those fragments of consciousness that are the archetypes and their associated complexes were known to the alchemists as the scintillae or sparks of the world soul, the natural light of the spirit of God in all things.

We don’t say........ Cheetham

And there is no way to prove this, logically?  

Maybe we’ll have to redefine logic....... which is kinda what we’re doing.    

The same applies to the Astronomia of Paracelsus. The interiorization of astronomy which spiritual hermeneutics requires cannot result in a system of laws telling us how the patterns of the stars affect our destinies. That is just another form of genetics, or sociology, or typology, and results in yet another set of laws applied from outside side upon our lives. The true interiorization of astronomy opens us to the all too unsettling animation of the presences both within and without.

Not too shabby........


6:40........

The universe is fixed, a geometric perfectly packed crystal..........?

Ok...... maybe I can understand when I take that with a grain of salt.  

Clearly, we have some sort of optimization process in play.  

We can better appreciate it from the other side.  

You should be aware of John Baez’ close packing of E8 in 24 dimensions....... https://golem.ph.utexas.edu/category/2016/03/e8_is_the_best.html

It explains much of physics.  And, yes, John is Joan’s brother.  

But far from giving us another set of rules devouring and annihilating our uniqueness, the interiorization that lies at the heart of the birth of the soul opens us to the unavoidable responsibilities that are the burden of our birth into this world. We must greet the bearers of those strange voices, we must be the host at the Feast, and welcome the strangers. This is a delicate business. Respect and attention, care and courtesy are required.

I bet smelly knows all about this stuff........

The only problem with Tom and smelly is that they are trying desperately to immanentize the Eschaton. The gaping abyss that they detect at the center of modern civilization is too big to be filled by any individual effort.

It can only be filled by the pleroma (close packing) that exists on the other side. The gates of Heaven are being opened....... none too soon........ none too late....... at the best possible time....... in the fullness of time.



(cont.......)

Angels and Demons are constrained within their geometry in drawing below. From the angels and demons perspective the edge is infinity.

MC Eschers drawing is a conformal map. We don’t care about size, just that the angles are correct. This map describes infinity. You can do this same thing to the Universe.

New theory the universe is expanding on a bubble of dark energy.





We mistake the map for the territory.

As many of you are aware, the Discloser was furloughed under orders from the President. Negotiations are underway to restore the Discloser to active duty, but they have become complicated by allegations that the Discloser may have acted without authorization to pander PP across state lines. It is unclear whether the Discloser will be formally charged with this offence, but if so, then his restoration could be in jeopardy. Please urge the Discloser to confess, performance reconciliation, and beg for mercy.

Who knew so much is going on in this noodle in our skulls

We are as babes on the shore of eternity.

We know so so little.

Humility and vigilance seem good ways to realize this.



Making the trip into the Underworld with Dante and Virgil, what better guides could you have?

Know this, you can make no progress because there is nothing that can progress and nothing to progress toward.

You can only be what you are here now.

It requires no effort to realize it.

You can’t transform yourself, the you that you imagine doesn’t exist separately from any thing.

To accept that will solve a great deal of trouble in your life, to deny it is just chasing your tail.

What can be understood is not IT.

You are an aperture the universe observes itself with.

This Way is a Watercourse Way...it flows.

The water will, through it’s weight and speed and gravity, tell you where to go.



The Luminous Darkness

The One beyond Understanding and Conception

Who is this god with no image then?

To trust a nameless force has got this is not atheistic, but the prime religious attitude.

An attitude of total trust and letting go, in the flow, not grasping.

This requires humility.

The left brain cannot admit it isn’t here.

When we don’t grasp, we are faith.

If you let go of all the idols, this unknown turns out to be you yourself.

All images of God demonstrate our lack of faith in ourselves ultimately.

The true faith does not chase or grab, then it comes to you.

Your soul descends as the bird to take you home.

It’s a nice fairytale.

It’s our fairytale.

What else do we have other than oblivion?

The left brain says fuck oblivion, while the right says, I’m coming home.

Dan,

Universe is not a collection of spheres.

Universe is not a vacuum.

Space is a depletion of consciousness.

Plasma (consciousness ) spins in an eternal chase of itself trying to reach rest.

Creation is where the geometry has enabled consciousness to form a local memory.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttFaHpuOY28&list=PL3jODeJQRU0lvBw2_LWCuutkHrKujmpp0&index=3

Smelly,

Water is not flowing, the wind is not blowing.

Every local memory has polarity and equator, with a heart centred 720 spin , each memory is within it's next larger memory and is attracted towards that's heart centre ( overall it's termed as gravity)

There is no force called gravity.

When another large memory interferes with this planets memory ( the moon is best clue)
it varies the heart centre location and thus We see tides.

The wind is a consequence of this with local implosion and outrush zones locally varying the direction of attraction of the atmosphere.

hobbit

hobbit,

If you want to be less literal about physics, try being less literal about cosmology.  

Try thinking in terms of metaphors.  That manner of thought will get us outside our box most expeditiously.  The world is a great metaphor/metanarrative rather than a great machine.  

Try not to be a mechanical fundamentalist, hobbit.  

You see animism as the only source of metaphor.  Like many animists, you hate persons.  I understand your antipathy.  

But understand, hobbit, that animals have no grasp of Truth.  You must not project that on to them.  

Don’t be afraid to own the Truth, hobbit.  No one else will.  

smelly is just one of an army of mystagogues.  Mystagogues, knowingly or not, are the handmaidens of tyrants.  

If we wish to extricate ourselves from the pall of tyranny, we must stand together as persons...... capable of grasping Truth.  

I have to tell the same thing to the Princess...... we won’t be able to save the animals without saving ourselves, hobbit.  

You have been operating too much in the shadow of smelly, hobbit.  

As I gradually tame/civilize smelly, I will be able to focus more attention on to you, hobbit.  Just don’t take it too personally!

If I cherrypick from the Bible, please forgive me.  Scriptures happen to be the greatest source of premodern/non-mechanistic metaphor that we possess.  Try not to let your antipathies blind you to existing sources of Truth.  

But your greatest blindness you share with every other modernist...... you share their desperate attempts to immanentize the Eschaton.

I have called smelly out on this.  Now I’m calling you out, hobbit..... try not to blink.  

Yes, hobbit, we are on a collision course with the Monad.  

If I can tame smelly, I can also tame the Monad..... just watch....

Yes, I know, the Monad looks pretty scary, but, in the End, it will turn out that we own the Monad.  Can you believe it?  

Jesus was just a tad too dualistic about the Monad.  Let’s see if we can be big enough to forgive him for that small lacuna.  Shall we, hobbit?

smelly is trying to protect me from having the Monad go to my head.  Yes, the exploding head syndrome (EHS) is an occupational hazard for us, monists.  

But, hey, some poor sod is going to have to break the historical ceiling of........ interpersonalism.  Ownership of the Monad is that ceiling.  

See....... and my head hasn’t even exploded..... has it, hobbit..... now, be honest......

Please, hobbit, allow me the temerity of planting the flag of Personhood on the newly rediscovered continent of the Monad.  Will you allow me just that one small favor, hobbit?  

I know..... Columbus died a pauper, but, heck, we still have Columbus Day..... don’t we?  

Melancholia, anyone........?  

The rattling of the cage by the Lake is a bit like the chirping of the Interferometer in Louisiana........ they are both registering the approach of our spiritual tsunami....... most recently predicted by Joachim da Fiore, way back in 1260.  

Isn’t that right, smelly?  Please, don’t be too bashful to correct me if I’m wrong.  

Anyone for Sunspot, NM......?


11..........

The stock market also serves as an early warning device for social upheavals........ occupy Wall Street...... we’ll see, won’t we, smelly?  

Am I going to tame an enraged Bear?  Well, maybe I can teach it some table manners.  


12:50............

Sure, phylogeny recapitulates ontogeny, but immanentizing/psychologizing the Eschaton is not going to make it go away.  It will enable a softer landing....... and there is nothing wrong with that....... but it won’t go away.  

Well, for the sake of full Disclosure, I am attempting to personalize the Eschaton, but that’s not quite the same as immanentizing it.  It is for the purpose of interpersonalizing the Eschaton, if you want to get technical about it.  

Does that mean that the Eschaton is optional for us humans?  Sorry, not quite........

No, all of Creation has been programmed with the Eschaton in mind.

The Eschaton was voluntary before the fact.  But we have already committed to the Best Possible World, for which the Eschaton is an essential feature.  I hope that’s ok with everyone.  You all understand, don’t you?  

Of course, you do.......



(cont........)

Civilize smelly, bahahahahaha

Hobbit my words are metaphors for what you speak of.

We ourselves are metaphors.

Beware of understanding, if you think you have it, you obviously don’t

My work progresses quite well actually Dan.

Zen,Taoism, Sufism, Perennial Wisdom, poetry, these are the big hints.

If you aren’t onto their thread, you aren’t paying attention.

Talking to idol worshippers is so boring, but we all try.

I guess eschatology is a forbidden science, according to smelly.

I’m still reading Tom Cheetham. He has some great insights.

But isn’t it obvious that Tom is in serious denial mode?

How can you be a student of the prophetic tradition, and then deny the essence of prophecy?

...

Dan,

After trying to read Your post 237, I had to go and lie down for an hour in a darkened room.
Not a clue what You are babbling about.

Hobbit

We are "timeless awareness"...
...
Some more "aware" than others..

I’m terribly sorry, Hobbit. I guess you’d never heard of an Eschaton before.

Don’t worry, my Eschaton is friendly. Can’t you see it wagging it’s tail?

Dan, you are missing the point on prophecy and history and poetry and what Tom points to.

Mystic philosophers seem to acknowledge what you struggle with, that poetry using imagination is a form of history.

Here and now is always the point.

For me, I study the history of consciousness as seen through our history and art on the subject.

History is only part of the map to the ultimate destiny of the individual soul.

Quaint Christian Eschatology just isn't up to the task.

Rene Guenon and other mystics have written a lot about history and mysticism.

The Christians have abdicated the mystical portal they had.

Write comparative religious stuff or write some poetry if you want to be fresh.

Your line is tired to my ears and hollow.

They silenced the true teachers early on in the church and now we have a bastardized idolized trinity story.

I see I am raised up to stand against you Dan.

...

"René Guénon, in The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of the Times, said that the darkness of our era is the result both of cyclical conditions—the inevitable degeneration of the cosmic environment in these last days of the Kali-yuga—and the actions of organized human groups, groups that are made possible by these conditions, and who also actively exploit them, so as to actualize negative potentials that, without their intervention, would remain latent; in the words of Jesus, “there needs be evil, but woe to him through whom evil comes.” Guénon called these groups working to invoke the most negative potentials of our times the “Counter-Initiation”; he also spoke of the opening up of “fissures” in the “great wall” that separates the material and the subtle domains, leading to the incursion of “infra-psychic forces” into our world, which will ultimately lead to its dissolution. It is my belief that the UFO phenomenon is an example of such forces, while the human groups who are apparently exploiting if not actually invoking these apparitions can accurately be described as agents the Counter-Initiation. The following article presents evidence of their activities, including their use of inverted forms of universal metaphysical principles as methods of mass social engineering and mind-control. We Traditionalists need to go beyond the sort of abstract, decorous lament with which we often address the present condition of our world, and directly confront the ingenious and active evil we must deal with in these times, so as to understand it in the most practical of terms. We cannot save the world, but we must, with God’s help, save our souls—a task that will be doubly difficult if we do not grasp the precise nature and agenda of the spiritual evil that is moving against us."

I know the agenda of Good and Evil.

I am part of IT and so are all of you.

This is about the world of the invisible next to ours.

I know the Daimon well now, that was where to look for the meaning of UFOs.

...

" According to the best available evidence, the UFO phenomenon has three separate yet intimately related aspects: 1) It manifests in terms of real material-world events, detectable by radar and sometimes leaving behind physical traces, events that are inexplicable according to mainstream science, though certain theories of post-Einsteinian physics might be able to speculate legitimately on some aspects of them; 2) It is also a psychic phenomenon that profoundly alters the consciousness of those exposed to it; 3) It is apparently surrounded by deception activities which mimic it, produced by actual human groups, as Jacques Vallee has demonstrated in his book Messengers of Deception.

           My central thesis regarding the UFO phenomenon is as follows: The UFO “aliens” are beings from another “dimension”—the world called in some systems the etheric plane, situated on the “isthmus” between the material world and the world of dreams and mental imagery. The etheric plane is home to the Jinn, the elemental spirits, the fairies, the Powers of the Air mentioned in Ephesians 2:2—the “air” in this sense denoting the subtle-material dimension. (The “border” between the etheric plane and the world defined by the five senses apparently has something to do with the electro-magnetic spectrum, as evidenced by the fact that the proximity of a UFO will often cause electronic equipment to malfunction.) Some of the denizens of that world are best described as demons. Not all etheric “nations” are demonic, just as not every fish in shark-infested waters is a shark; nonetheless the early Christian Fathers were very wise to counsel strict avoidance of that realm, especially since the people who most commonly interacted with it in their time—and are still doing so today—were (and are) the Pagan magicians.    

           The prime enigma is: How do the three aspects of the phenomenon relate to each other? Aren’t they mutually exclusive? If UFOs are a real physical phenomenon, doesn’t that mean that they have to be alien spaceships? If they are a psychic phenomenon, doesn’t that mean that they couldn’t be physical craft? And if the phenomenon is shown to be surrounded by human deception activities of the “Mission Impossible” variety, doesn’t that mean that the whole thing is a hoax?

           No on all three counts.

Demons are subtle beings inhabiting the psychic or etheric plane who can temporarily materialize themselves and various objects in this world, but who cannot remain on our material plane in stable form for very long—if they could, they wouldn’t have to possess people in order to work their evil in this world."

Jung has initiated or filled in a lot of a new religion of direct participation.

You must contend with Jung if you are an eschatologist.

...

"The deception activities of human groups, besides being attempts to piggyback on and use a phenomenon that the deceivers didn’t originate and can’t control (the same can perhaps be said for various human attempts to mimic alien “technology”) may actually be—or also be—acts designed not simply to deceptively imitate the “aliens” in order to influence mass belief, but to actually invoke them, in line with the practice of “sympathetic magic” as described in the classic work on mythology and primitive belief, The Golden Bough by Sir James Frazer. This depressing thesis leads us directly to the question of the possible involvement of the intelligence community and various arcane technologists, whose connection to the UFO phenomenon have been documented both by Jacques Vallee in Messengers of Deception and Peter Levenda in Sinister Forces: A Grimoire of American Political Witchcraft, in outright Satanism. (Levenda, for one, gives much well-researched evidence in support of this thesis).

The case of pioneer rocket scientist Jack Parsons comes immediately to mind. Parsons was a follower of black magician Aleister Crowley and an associate of L. Ron Hubbard, another follower of Crowley who founded the Church of Scientology and who also (according to my correspondence with Beat Generation writer William Burroughs in the late 1960’s, when Burroughs was in the process of breaking with Scientology) had a background in Naval Intelligence, something confirmed by Levenda. Parsons (according to Vallee) claimed to have met a “Venusian” in the Mojave Desert, performed Pagan rituals at his launchings (as recounted by Levenda), and went on to co-found the Aerojet Corporation and the Jet Propulsion Laboratory; a crater was named after him on the dark side of the Moon. In light of these revelations, I believe we should take seriously Eastern Orthodox priest Seraphim Rose’s assertion, in Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, that the great expansion of the UFO phenomenon after WWII was in order to lay the psychic groundwork for the advent of the regime of Antichrist, particularly since there is no question that the mass belief in UFOs, whether conceived of as alien spacecraft or as “interdimensional” manifestations, has been an important element in the widespread pagan/occult revival that has so obviously weakened and undermined the world’s religions."

" The French metaphysician René Guénon, The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of the Times, provides a solid metaphysical basis for idea of Antichrist by demonstrating that this figure (whom Muslims call al-Dajjal, “the deceiver”) is not simply a just-so fable that we must take on blind faith, but represents a necessary dialectical phase in the dissolution of the present cycle-of-manifestation, and the ultimate re-creation of the world. Guénon also provides a cosmological context for the UFO phenomenon, though he does not mention it by name, limiting himself to describing the breakthrough of “infra-psychic forces” due to the hardening of the cosmic environment under the regime of materialism (the phase he calls “Anti-Tradition”), followed by the psycho-physical fracturing of that environment in our own time (the phase of “Counter-Tradition”, i.e. false religion). Anti-tradition peaked in the 19th Century under the regime of “classical materialism”, while Counter-Tradition is expresses itself in terms of our present postmodern worldview, one that might be termed “magical scientism”. The upshot is that fissures are now starting to appear in the “great wall” separating the material world from the subtle-energy dimension, home to those entities that we regard, according to the scientistic paradigm, as “extra-terrestrial entities”. Seraphim Rose, citing many of the Eastern Orthodox saints and the Greek Fathers, as well as Guénon himself, draws many exact parallels between the UFO phenomenon and the experiences of the early Christian saints with the demonic powers, in the days when Christians were still a small minority within a largely Pagan society where the practice of magic was commonplace."

So you see, to understand what's happening out there, you have to enact this passion play in here.

Then it all becomes clear.

dan wrote:I’m terribly sorry, Hobbit.  I guess you’d never heard of an Eschaton before.  

Don’t worry, my Eschaton is friendly.  Can’t you see it wagging it’s tail?  

There is no end, as there was no beginning, just a flow of transmutations , if the present soup is rapidly spun a variant outcome will prevail.

The world may be dominated by hobbits.

Hobbit

With big teeth.

Seraphim Rose.

I like that name.

Voltaire: “The best is the enemy of the good.”

Confucius: "Better a diamond with a flaw than a pebble without."

Shakespeare: “Striving to better, oft we mar what's well.”

Some far out stuff, or is this just the inner world exposed to the left brain.



I do not promote any organized religion, best to stay frosty and open IMHO and be sure of nothing.

Prophecy is too easy to believe in, but we can't understand a prophecy really.

The prophecy was very personal to the prophet.

So take this with a grain of salt.

It is an experience to see and feel the Cosmos looking at itself through you.

This was just served up from Tom and The Green Man. Dan would argue eschatology with the Green Man and the Great Mother, Bahahahahahaha!

Go right ahead, civilize this....I just said this this morning in response to Dan’s obtuseness, they all agree with me old Man!!!

You are just here for me to push off of I see

“The Italian philosopher Gianni Vattimo works in the tradition defined by Nietzsche, Heidegger, and Derrida. He can be counted among those who are, often unhelpfully, labeled "postrnodernists." In our context, what is important and "postmodern" about Vattitno is his attack on dogma, on any attempt to impose a single truth on the plurality and variety of human lives.

For Vattimo, Nietzsche's radical nihilism, expressed in Zarathustra's cry "God is dead!’ is the prelude to a freedom that is only now coming within our reach, and that is in fact the culmination and final destiny of the Christian tradition. It is significant that both Nietzsche and Corbin look back to the Zoroastrian roots of the eschatological religions of the West. Norman Cohn has argued that it was Zoroaster who shattered the vision of a cyclic, timeless cosmos, mos, and initiated a view of a world moving inexorably forward toward a final consummation in history. The origins of the eschatological worldview can be traced back to Zoroaster's proclamation of the Final Battle at the end of time that will usher in the paradise that is the goal of history.”

WOWEE!!!

“Nietzsche reaches back to the Avesta and reads there the desperate, ultimate fate of this history in the death of the God who promised so much and gave, in the end, Nothing. For Corbin, the mythic and the transhistorical have never in truth been fully suppressed. We still live in that mythic present. Our insertion in history is only partial. The timelessness of the eternal present is always available, and eschatological hopes apply here and now For Nietzsche himself this "greatest recent event," the death of God, was an occasion for joy and freedom:

‘Our heart overflows with gratitude, amazement, anticipation, expectation.At last the horizon appears free again to us, even granted that it is not bright; at last our ships may venture out again, venture out to face any danger; all the daring of the lover of knowledge is permitted again; the sea, our sea, lies open again; perhaps there has never yet been such an "open sea."'

It’s a tricky way to explain how I also feel is evolving. This is like watching a fairy thread a needle and make 5 loops at the exact same moment.

I also fiercely attack any dogma I find, I kill it where I find it. I smell it like only a Daimon can and I have this shiny sword here to do it with

The world and all religion is being dissolved before our eyes by nihilism and its technology and capitalism.

This is the way it comes about.

Major synchronicities in this post, if you aren’t paying attention, you are a muppet moron.

We have to accept not knowing.

Everyone can author their own Bible, I have done it.

The mystic now ends your history Dan.

“Vattimo points to Joachim of Fiore's doctrine of the Third Age of the Holy Spirit, in which the inner, spiritual sense of the scriptures takes precedence over the legal, disciplinarian narian interpretation. It is, he says, a matter of taking the doctrine of kenosis seriously.”

It’s revealed to us each. It has to be discovered by each one.

The final religion is one of the spirit seen in poetry and story and myth and accessible through our imagination.

The cart that brought us here now must be chopped up, or has been, and we dance in its blue flame.

The Green Man is getting intense...I have to cross check Tom’s references and read his writing a few times over and over, but I’m getting the picture.

I feel an image forming in the mirror.

Augustine's words, "Love God and do as you please!"

or

Love your self and do as thou will.

This is like some unfolding drama...more from Green Man, we are on the edge of it now...

“Speculative thought can only approach the truth when it serves to polish the mirror, the speculum in which the images of transcendence can be apprehended. Corbin's hermeneutic is always gnostic, it is always an uncovering, a revelation of something given as presence and as Gift. And it can never be the world of Promethean man, of technology, nology, that frees us for this uncovering: the Revelation has always been there in the more-than-human world, and there it remains.

On Vattimo's account God's descent into history dissolves the world, unmakes its structures, and reveals Being as event. The Tana of God into the world annihilates God Himself. The Incarnation removes the Reality behind the appearances and plunges us all into the endless world of story telling and interpretation. The metaphysics of Presence devolves into a metaphysics of Absence, of continual undoing, in a cosmos where there are no Names. Positive knowledge is vaporized into a perpetual unknowing through the encounter with the Absent God. We are left with weak thought, pietas, and love.

Vattimo's interpretation allows an uncompromising stand against tyranny and oppression. It privileges freedom over domination by removing any possible ble grounds for the justification of any Master. But clearly from a viewpoint such a Corbin's or that of the Sufi masters he represents we are on very dangerous ground, the edge of the Abyss.”

I have come to IT then...

“Where is the individual in all this?

Where does the human person stand?

And how are we to understand the primordial facts of nature, and the miracle of language itself? It is not clear that this "accomplished nihilism" can give an account of the world that can do justice to the body, and to the place of humans in the natural world. And practically speaking we must ask what the consequences may be of trying to make openness to the nihil a public program. How far can people live without out Presence to balance Absence? We have seen already that the Great Chain of Being was not the static structure of Presence that its critics claim. Surely it is true that when Being is regarded as Presence alone, not balanced by that moment of nothingness that the Deus absconditurn initiates, then idolatry and violence and violation are ensured. But it is far from clear that we can live with Absence alone. The encounter with the Darkness is the most perilous stage, but Sernnani tells us that it must result in dementia, or in Resurrection. The encounter cannot be maintained forever.”

Tom is going to try to show how technology is the ultimate fulfillment of incarnation and kenosis, which is at the heart of Christianity.

I’m somewhere floating between Corbin and Vattimo, it’s resurrection or bust.

Letting it all go now...I have to feel my way through this darkness.