Sun goes out?

First topic message reminder :

New topic……..

Gary,

Yes, Leibniz had it figured out……..

Once you know what’s really going on, you can sit back and enjoy the show.

Yes, and Fermat also figured out fermat’s last theorem……. several centuries before the muppets figured it out.  

The academic muppets are about eat a whole bunch of pie 🥧……. humble pie.  

Then Maupertuis put all together for classical mechanics.

All we had to do was add a little quantum sauce.  

But how does the photon know how to bend when it strikes the water?

More to the point…….. how will we know how to bend when we hit the Katechonic event horizon?  

If I were you, I’d put away my slide rule.  

As she says at the end of the video…….. the reason that we need the measurement postulate is that we don’t take this dependence on the future seriously enough……… Hmmm ………

Maybe she just said a mouthful.  

Maybe she’s saying that we don’t have enough faith in the best possible world hypothesis.  

Let’s hope that vladdie can keep the faith……. come hell or high water!  

Well, ok, we will have the best possible amount of faith when we need to have it.  
…………


Here’s an oldie but goodie……… Russell debates Copleston……. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVLKURgfft0

R: The difficulty of this argument is that I don't admit the idea of a necessary being and I don't admit that there is any particular meaning in calling other beings "contingent." These phrases don't for me have a significance except within a logic that I reject.

C: Do you mean that you reject these terms because they won't fit in with what is called "modern logic"?

R: Well, I can't find anything that they could mean. The word "necessary," it seems to me, is a useless word, except as applied to analytic propositions, not to things.

Hmmm ………. Hey, Bertie, better watch out that you don’t become useless…….!



(cont……..)

God/Source, loves muppets.  
It loves muppets courage to speak their hearts.
This world being one of his most favorite.
Problem is, respecting free will or intervention on suicide?

Answer, look at the Universe and the number of habitable worlds discovered so far....how many times has God hit the start over button?  Have we suicided in eons past?  Is this life a matter of sorting out prior baggage in real time?  If God is eternal, then he/it has time to repeat as many times as it takes.

What does that make us?  gluttons for self-punishment.

One of these rounds, we'll get our heads screwed on straight.  Except for one incy wincy problem...nukes wipe out soul constructions not just the containers.  

Congrats, you're not going back to the stone age.  You're not jumping back to Source.  You're going to reincarnate as an amoeba a few times first and get eaten by bigger things first till you tire of the humble mumble pie and earn another shot at being something like we are now. 

OR you could just get this round right and not suicide.

Hey R tell Putin I said this little reminder.  He might want to pass it on to the Chinese.  We see them.

Cy,

God knows how precious your free will is to you…….. is to all of us.  

This will probably be the toughest issue we’ll have to face.  

However, perhaps we should listen to Chivo……..

We will not truly be able to live until we can fully immerse ourselves in the experience.  

We won’t be able to do that so long as we are taking ourselves too seriously.

As long as we are doing that, we are holding back.  

Fear not, Cy……. jump on in……. the water’s great…….!

And about all those other civilizations out there…… fake news!!

And about vladdie…….. not to worry…… he’s on our team.  

What do they say……… ding-dong ….. the Katechon is dead!  



(cont………)

Point of fact, I only bent one knee

There is one thing Jesus said and lived that trumps Trump and all pretenders and why I became his friend as a kid, love each other.

Just love the lost and the found.

We have given this lip service for 2000 years, but god meant it, do it.

Love your enemy, but watch your back.

Love nature, but watch out when she’s pissed.

Love your life, it’s a precious gift.

Love your leaders, though you disagree.

I mean it so the universal solvent.

The Prometheans would argue to use your power, an iron will and fist are best.

Marcus Aurelius said “You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.”

It is harder for a human to learn power over themselves than to exercise it over others.

And when you learn to exercise control over your own power, you don’t want to use it over others.

The ancient gods seem like children the way they used their power so emotionally and frivolously.

They seemed to gain or steal a power they were not ready for or mature enough to wield.

The gods should worship us it is was said.

Humanity is in a very unique position.

Living out of weakness, with the threat of death any moment, is beautiful and heroic it seems.

Not so much when a lion is eating you perhaps.

I feel all of life was somehow to give us the chance to love.

Richard Dawkins would laugh at me.

Well isn’t he the dumb one then.

Suicide is such a cope out.

Such an abdication.

A people who would suicide are not worthy of life or existence.

But if eternity is always now, I guess there will be infinite attempts.

But maybe not, maybe this is what is best.

There is no need for trial and error as Sabine describes.

What happens is optimal.

The Stoics live in acceptance.

Jesus said accept one another as you are.

Can eternity have meaning?

Does it need to?

Why do we seek and need meaning?

Just to procreate?

I don’t think so.

Because this and what we do matters and we all feel it, and even more with finite time.

We have to be careful literalizing the symbols and our feelings.

I feel the responsibility to live the best we can to the electrons of my atoms.

We are not lost in a meaningless cosmos, that way is death and darkness and gnashing of teeth.

—

Nothing we could say or scribble could ultimately be true completely.

Does God need us?

The me could not persist as it does in the body.

Being a dream being does not mean we are not real.

Prophetically, this may be the end times or close of the dream, I can accept this.

But every age has felt so.

Imagine the Black Plague, marauding Vikings, conquering Barbarians, WWI, WWII, the Civil War, I imagine each age has felt like an ending.

I think it’s true, something is ending, but something is always being born too.

I think this is the dawning of the heart and a new understanding of being.

What are we to make of the sun going out and portals opening?

I don’t believe in fate per se or determinism.

At the quantum level, all paths are taken.

There is so much turmoil, the petulant child does not want to accept love.

The only way out is in.

Love is what connects us, love is what most of us would say is the best of life.

Soros is saying that this is likely the end at Davos even.

This dream may indeed become a nightmare.

So yah, it looks very dark and the world is tearing itself apart.

Still, I’m not cynical.

There is an eruption happening from the unconscious.

It is vast and endless and no one mind can see it all.

Each is just a spotlight on parts of the underlying reality.

Our attachments are being pulled on.

We need to all let our tight grasp loosen.

Most US Christians and Jihadists have chosen materialism over love.

This white rebellion was predicted for half a century.

It’s playing out as it was mostly predicted.

They are literally suffering a mass psychosis.

How do you fight insane anger?

Empathy, again, understand and meet them where they are and embrace them.

I feel I’m living my dream in the midst of existential threats.

We can turn things around.

I’m not just dreaming, I’m doing.

This is a probabilistic universe.

We can align ourselves with the best probability.

Let’s do that.

I can’t, nor will I take the fatalistic path.

Hmm

Was brushing up on ole Leibniz.

Man wasn’t really down with materialism at all.

Quite a brilliant dude to say the least.

Apparently like a lot of brilliant dudes, was down with Spinoza’s god more than the Christian one.

Safer to say you were down with Spinoza than to be an outright atheist back in the day.

“The monist philosophical system of Baruch Spinoza that defines "God" as a singular self-subsistent substance, with both matter and thought being attributes of such.

In a letter to Henry Oldenburg, Spinoza wrote: "as to the view of certain people that I identify god with nature (taken as a kind of mass or corporeal matter), they are quite mistaken". For Spinoza, our universe (cosmos) is a mode under infinite attributes, of which we can perceive two: Thought and Extension. God has infinitely many other attributes which are not present in our world. According to German philosopher Karl Jaspers, when Spinoza wrote "Deus sive Natura" ("God or Nature") he meant God was Natura naturans not Natura naturata, that is, ‘a dynamic nature in action, growing and changing, not a passive or static thing.’”

I guess I’m kinda down with Spinoza.

“Spinoza was considered to be an atheist because he used the word "God" [Deus] to signify a concept that was different from that of traditional Judeo–Christian monotheism. "Spinoza expressly denies personality and consciousness to God; he has neither intelligence, feeling, nor will; he does not act according to purpose, but everything follows necessarily from his nature, according to law...." Thus, Spinoza's cool, indifferent God differs from the concept of an anthropomorphic, fatherly God who cares about humanity.“

“French philosopher Martial Guéroult suggested the term "panentheism", rather than "pantheism" to describe Spinoza's view of the relation between God and the world. The world is not God, but it is, in a strong sense, "in" God. Not only do finite things have God as their cause; they cannot be conceived without God. In other words, the world is a subset of God.”

This is pretty good. Kind of agree with Martial.

This is basic stuff for Dan.

So all these smart dudes can have their theories.

Nothing can really be apart from One.

We could be an organ within it or something much smaller.

When one sinks into being and experience, it isn’t god’s voice one hears, it’s more like a feeling.

A relaxing while riding the waves on your back.

There is something in us though that can think at us.

But it never identifies itself really.

It may be of a higher order, it most surely is.

That personal god nonsense of Christians just doesn’t hold up to experience.

When one feels or sees or hears this voice or thought, their imaginations kick in to overdrive.

What one feels is more ineffable, nameless, faceless, infinitely bigger.

And yes, terrifying.

But then you have the intimacy of Rumi and Shams, in love with this.

"The meaning of life is just to be alive. It is so plain and so obvious and so simple. Any yet, everybody rushes around in a great panic as if it were necessary to achieve something beyond themselves." ~ A. Watts

99,

“The meaning of life is to be alive………..”

Sounds very close to…….. I am that/who I am.

We are the only ones destined to exist……. sua sponte.

Nothing else can know or even be aware that it exists.

This is just the definition of personhood.

Chivo is infatuated with the Transpersonal.

In my humble estimation, trans-personal is an oxymoron or else a pleonasm.

The person is nothing if not also a bootstrap 🥾 device…….. bootstrapped to Eternity.



(cont……..)

Penrose: "You need a theory of consciousness that doesn't allow the superpositions ... a violation of the faith ..."

1440z………

Gary,

Clearly, something has to hold the world together.  

It was Parmenides who first recognized this to be the basic problem of existence.  

Yes, we speak of the unity of consciousness……. rather glibly.  

We perceive separate things……. there would be no perception without separation.  

However, the many always come as a context……. é pluribus…….

But why not many worlds?  

All we have to do is look at the night sky ……. so many worlds!  

Or we look at the Quantum…….. so many Universes!

However, there once actually were other worlds…….. America, Africa, Asia…..

Now we have just…….. a world.  

Still, we try endlessly to imagine the Other.  

All this imagining springs from the mind of Darwin.  

Before Darwin, it sprang from the mind of Empedocles……. atoms swerving in the Abyss.  

Thinkers of the East never succumbed to these centripetal fantasies.  

Only us Westerners could yield to the blue sky dreams of modernism.  


1830……….

We divide consciousness into qualitative and quantitative components, supposing the former to be subjective and the latter to be objective.  

It was Descartes who first made this analysis.  

It has stuck.  

This is how the notion of mind v matter came about.  

This subdivision was greatly aided by the notion of Creator v Creation.  

We then have the mystical and prophetic traditions.  

The mystical tradition makes heavy use of the transpersonal dimension, while it is studiously ignored on the other side.  

The very idea of maya entails an interpersonal Creation.  

Keeping these two traditions separate geographically kept the Truth at bay.  

The advent of science created a spiritual vacuum where a great variety of metaphysical ideas could freely mingle.  

All one has to do is go cherry picking, to flesh out a new frame of monism.  

And the monism is coming from where?  

Well, it comes from the hard problem of consciousness……. sometimes stated as the unity of consciousness.  

Monotheism displays some of this unity, but it and science were two forces behind the Katechon.  

But we should note that the Katechon was very well maintained in the East, without the help of science and monotheism.  

But those two traditions pointed, at least implicitly, to a transcendental dimension….. in the future.  

Hmmm……. is monotheism necessarily prophetic?  

Well, it necessarily points to a particular Creation.  

If you have an Alpha, can the Omega be far behind?  

Yahwism and Zoroastrianism both feature an Armageddon…… a resolution……. at the End of time/Creation.  

The proselytizing of a Gospel eventually emerged.  

The Protestant work ethic and the industrial Revolution were the logical culminations.  

Wonderful, but why does Creation have to end?  

Why can’t Heaven always remain in the future?

Well, why can’t the eschatology just remain personal?  

Why the sky , if we’re not supposed to have blue sky dreams?  

But why proselytize?  

It certainly didn’t come out of the Old Testament.  

It had to be something about the jguy.  

Something that is not quite explicit……. well, not to chick , anyway.  
……….


It took Saul/Paul to really get that ball rolling.  

But keep in mind that Paul didn’t found any new churches.  

The ones he visited already existed.  



(cont……..)

If you try to speak or write about this, you only end up in circles and opinions.

It just can’t be summed up.

It can only be lived.

The dispensationalists are in error.

They take the Bible as literal.

This is obviously incorrect.

This is a problem from the war between the right and left brain.

Taking words in a book literally is ridiculous.

Here is a cure.

A Bird In Flight Leaves No Trace

https://terebess.hu/zen//mesterek/Bird.pdf

“The Way involves awakening to the mind. How could it involve speech? Language is only used to help immature children understand.”

Dan speaks as a small child to children.

“Language is merely a means to help people realize the Way, like pretending a yellow leaf is real gold to make a child stop crying. Therefore you should not think that there is real meaning in language.

This statement is made from the standpoint of the Way. It is not that there is something wrong with language itself. What the master said here is that language is only a means, not the goal.”

“The moment you recognize the nature of the mind,
you can only say it is inconceivable.

Since you thoroughly understand that there is nothing to be
attained, the moment there is attainment, you cannot say that you know.

Although the mind is made manifest through the myriad sense realms, it truly leaves no trace wherever it appears. If you go with the flow and recognize the nature, you will have neither joys nor worries.”

ftgm recommends the following……… Close Encounters…… Jason Jorjani (2021)……..

Hesiod refers to titans such as Prometheus and Atlas as the most primordial gods. My work takes its departure from Martin Heidegger’s prophecy of a return of the gods as the future of a poetic reflection on the sciences from beyond the end of Philosophy.
………..

Heidegger only obliquely, or at best esoterically, addressed that feature of human experience which has the greatest potential to light up the deep structure of scientific practice, to literally comprehend it, from out of what currently lies at its fringe: the spectral.
………

Every culture is built on binary oppositions and marginalizing exclusions attendant to totemic taboos that knot its social fabric together. Spectral phenomena radically compromise such constructions that are intended to guard a given society against the terrifying abyss of the incomprehensible in Nature.

Hmmm …….. shades of the Katechon.  

…….. the unique power of such phenomena to do so lies in the way that they manifest an irreducible spectrum and haunt everything taken to be fixed with the specter of what is yet to come.
………

Whereas primitive cultures were somewhat aware of the destructive power of the spectral that they occulted through the mythic structures of their society, so that these spectral forces were at least recognized within a certain context wherein their power was released or channeled for various purposes, the modern paradigm epitomized by Descartes has been built on an unprecedented suppression of the spectral.

The norms of both rational scientific practice and rationalized religious faith in revelations excludes the paranormal, in large part by defining it as such — as a “supernatural” that is irrational in the context of a mechanistic model of Nature, one which occludes the ungraspable Supernature that shines through these very phenomena.

Thomas Kuhn, Paul Feyerabend, Michel Foucault, and Jacques Derrida have all studied the mechanisms of exclusionary marginalization at work in shifts in the framework of knowledge. My point of departure is to situate the problem of the paranormal with respect to their understandings of how structures of knowledge are forged, sustained, and overturned. Unlike Kuhn, who thinks that the exclusionary moves constitutive of framing a given paradigm are necessary for scientific development, Feyerabend argues that the exploratory quest for discovery would be best served by encouraging a plurality of theories in tension with one another.

Hmmm ……..

Tension……..?  

chick sees no tension.  

chick just sees the Truth…… trying to peek through.  

I draw out this insight of Feyerabend by presenting Michel Foucault’s largely parallel account of the construction of the “objective facts” (and of the corresponding form of subjectivity) that constitute the content of any given episteme or paradigmatic frame of knowledge. Such frameworks are constructed, sustained, and subsumed by others through a network of power relations……

Some of the above quotes are actually from Jorjani’s Introduction to Prometheus and Atlas (2016).  

Jorjani is talking all around the Katechon, but can never quite put his finger on it.  

Maybe he thinks he can immanentize the Eschaton……. good luck jorji!  

Clearly, jorji knows a lot……. he just doesn’t know the Princess .  

Many parapsychologists have missed this forest for the trees. They have failed to recognize that their research opens up the ultimate epistemological abyss.

Amen , brother!

Meanwhile, for all their talk about “deconstruction,” even so-called “postmodern” philosophers are still unconsciously terrified by the prospect of finding that epistemic frameworks are “really” lacking any foundation — any principle of Reality — that is not psycho-socially constructed as an expression of the will to power.

And what is the ultimate will to power……… Agape.  

It is possible that jorji has no clue about the Anthropic Principle.  

Terror in the face of the spectral is the occulted foundation of the Cartesian world order.

It is my contention that the basic structure of Descartes’ thought, which becomes determinative of modernity, involves the imprisonment of a hyperconscious but powerless mind within a set of cogs and wheelworks embedded in a Nature that is reduced to a terrifyingly merciless machine. This is an outcome of Descartes’ attempt to maintain a substantial distinction between Mind and Matter by prohibiting every class of psychical phenomena that would allow for consciousness to directly interact with physical bodies. Descartes’ suppression of the spectral is in turn, I argue, inextricable from his polar opposition between Perfect Being and absolute Nothingness. Biographically, it is also bound up with Descartes’ own terrifying paranormal experience and his subsequent commitment, as a Jesuit spy, to clandestinely help wage a Catholic war against “demonic” occultists.

chick had no clue about René.  

It looks like the chickens are coming home to roost.



(cont……..)

There is absolutely no truth in those words.

Jorjani is a petulant child.

Hmmm ………

It looks like jorji hit a sensitive spot with Chivo .

This may be where Chivo is coming from……. https://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/03/jason-reza-jorjani-stony-brook-alt-right-arktos-continental-philosophy-modernity-enlightenment/  

Aliens, Antisemitism, and Academia
BY
HARRISON FLUSS LANDON FRIM
Alt-right conspiracy theorists have embraced postmodern philosophy. The Left should return to the Enlightenment to oppose their irrational and hateful politics.

Second, Jorjani’s work participates in a significant philosophical tradition that combines antisemitism with occult beliefs. The long historical association between irrationalism and anti-Judaism suggests that they emanate from a common worldview. After all, the mystical, neo-pagan writings of Dietrich Eckart inspired much of the Third Reich’s racial policy. Houston Stewart Chamberlain, Hitler’s friend and mentor, proclaimed that “every Mystic is, whether he will or not, a born Anti-Semite.”
……….

The institutional embarrassment certainly stems from Jorjani’s reactionary views on culture, which he outlines in Prometheus and Atlas, the book based on his dissertation. But the parade of oddities that appear in the book — including, but not limited to, sorcerers, precogs, ancient aliens, telepathy, and the sunken city of Atlantis — are equally disconcerting.

Hmmm ……..

At its most consistent, Enlightenment rationalism replaced pluralism with monism. It did away with the medieval conception of a stratified and enchanted cosmos, wherein each part of nature (planets, living things, inanimate objects) obeyed their own local laws. The probabilistic view of the world, which made room for all sorts of miracles and divine interventions, began to disappear. A properly universal conception of nature, subject to one intelligible and determining natural law, displaced the mystery and spirituality that defined the medieval period.

This new worldview elicited an updated view of humanity as well. The qualitative plurality of peoples gave way to a belief in one intelligible human nature, common to all, and commonly governed by our natural faculty of reason. Enlightenment principles thus opposed the subjugation of minority communities based on some supposedly innate difference from the majority.

True to form, Jorjani insists on going further. He uses James’s empiricism to identify revelatory and miraculous experiences as real and historical, rather than as symbolic or allegorical. As a result, his reading of Exodus, Joshua, and Ezekiel treats the Hebrew God not as a hazy vision of some transcendent being but as a finite creature. Yahweh does not appear in the manner of an infinite God, but simply as “unknown,” in the sense of an UFO that hovers directly within our line of sight. Jorjani’s hyper-literalism transforms the Jewish God into an extraterrestrial intelligence that telepathically communicates with Abraham, Moses, Joshua, and Ezekiel.

Oh dear, the jguy is just another ET.  

From Heidegger, Jorjani takes the idea that one’s historical culture matters more than objective reality. As opposed to the Enlightenment belief that time and space are uniform and measurable in some objective way, Heidegger claims that each group of people subjectively wills and shapes its own world and destiny. No common universe belongs to all; there is only a pluriverse of conflicting worldviews and forces. As Jorjani paraphrases Heidegger, each historical community struggles “to become more essentially what it is, or to perish in enslavement to another people and its world.”

According to ftgm, jorji believes that ‘we’ came from Mars.  

Aw, gee whizz, jorji, I thought we came from the Source.

Oh, well, can’t win them all.  

From these premises, Jorjani concludes that a liberal society based on privacy and equality is impossible. James’s radical empiricism allows him to posit the existence of a “psychic elite” that would require the sort of organic-corporate state that Hitler advocates, and Jorjani cites this approvingly in his Stockholm speech.

He synthesizes this insight with Heidegger’s world pluralism to imply that such a state must not only be internally homogenous but externally world-conquering. This echoes Hitler’s statement at the end of Mein Kampf that the purity of the Aryan race entails its potential to master the world.

I dare say that our poor little jorji is out immanentize the Eschaton.  

Good luck with your immanentizing, my little friend!  

As for the Jacobin Magazine……..

From Descartes, Spinoza, and the French materialists to the French and Haitian revolutions to Hegel and Marx, we have a strain of thought that proceeds from an intelligible world to the full emancipation of humanity. We should return to this canon, if we want to effectively resist the rise of an irrational right.

Yes, Jacobin, good luck with your materialism!  



(cont………)

I’ve been the petulant child.

Takes one to know one.

Words are filled with gods Proclus said.

True masters do not to seek to change the world, petulant children do, they reveal reality through themselves.

Language is dangerous, it’s like a poison, it came from snakes.

True magick, they can change matter, and cloud the mind.

One has to be healed and protected from them before words can be properly understood and used.

Until then, children are playing with fire.

Chivo,

Suppose that all we want to do is understand the world and our place in it…….

Mr. Firmage now holds an estimated >1 percent of the vote -- likely to rise to >5 percent in the coming weeks. He is holding fast to a non-partisan position of disclosure, willing to step down from the spotlight if offered a position as VP by either party.

With 5% of the vote, he might get a cabinet position……. or perhaps a Pentagon position with the Space Force.

Mr. Firmage appears to be a goof.

He’s got nothin on smelly

I’d never seek to lead anyone beside myself.

Trust no one seeking or supporting power.

They are ruled by the beast.

Marcus Aurelius, one of the best leaders of all time, only cared to rule himself, power was forced on him.

The true leader serves the people by being as excellent they can be themselves.

Pigs only serve themselves.

Dan, each of us are where we need to be and have what we need…if we accept it.

Now you know and understand your place.

No explanation needed or possible.

Remarkably simple and beautiful and profound.

Chivo,

Ok, then I guess I’m at the chick place.  

The Princess had the same suggestion……. know thyself, chick.  


Foot,

Joe could be a political appointee to the office of the Secretary of Defense……. liaison to the Secretary of the Space Force.

The Secretary of the Space Force, needs to be an officer, not civilian, I believe.



(cont……..)

If she said know thyself, there may be hope for her yet, if she lives it.

She isn’t anywhere near smelly or she would be here, I’ll wait.

I’m calling out all pretenders.

Show me what ya got.

Until then, I’ll be here in the garden 🪴 sippin on some ambrosia playing with the gods.

I will give you hint about the greatest part of life, nothing matters more than knowing thyself.

Nuthin.

Chivo,

Excellent, and what is yourself?

If I showed you, your atoms would sing.

I AM THAT I AM

Well, Chivo,

If it’s all the same to you, I guess I’d rather have the Princess show me……. she is that she is!
………….


jorji in Close Encounters……..

This would not happen overnight. Like any technology, it would take time to develop, and then more time to test and refine, to the point where it could be used masterfully. Imagine that developmental period as a time line that starts to curve around on itself until it forms something like the “event horizon” of a black hole. This is the biggest event in all of history, because it is no longer strictly speaking in history. Rather, history is inside it. Envision the vortex defined by the aforementioned line that is bent into the circle, in other words, imagine the interior of the event horizon, as the time continuum of our past and future history.

Hmmm ………

Sound familiar?



(cont…….)