B - j - c67890

First topic message reminder :

Bjc could stand for lots of things.  It’s possible to suppose that it stands Baltimore Junior College.  It’s possible to suppose that c stands for chick, which is short for chicken.  

Talk about a pink slip, yesterday, puts me in mind of being laid off, which puts me in mind of a retrospective.........

And a topic header does require at least ten characters.......

The allotted length for a thread is 40 pages...... giving us a chance to take the occasional breather...... as the show goes on.

1310z........ 

Chivo , 

Most folks are reasonably comfortable, and do like to live in the present.  

I’m also reasonably comfortable, but my mind does wander, as minds are wont to do.  

I think about the present...... I also think about the absent.  

I think about how things stay the same, and how they change. 

Our nervous systems are keyed into change, whether we like it or not.  

That’s what nerves are about...... detecting change.  

Some folks are more nervy than others. 


1400........ 

There are animals and plants.  Animals are into exploring.  

I’m an armchair explorer...... exploring while firmly planted...... that’s what philosophers do....... sorry .  

And, with the magic of the internet, it takes considerable effort to do otherwise.  


Back to the Sun........ yes, it is a standout ‘object’, but, still, it’s main attribute is its alleged objecthood.  

I mean, that’s what objects do...... they stand out.  

As an immaterialist, I’m skeptical of objects.  

Mathematical objects are my exhibit A.  What is the nature of their existence?  

There would be no physical objects, were they not mathematically informed....... that’s what we learned in physics 101...... objects are made up of fields of subjective probability.  

But, still, what about that tree in my backyard?  

I would say that it’s existence is relative..... as is mine and yours.  

And, for animals, the tree can’t be said to exist...... only we, sapient creatures, go around objectifying things.  

Philosophers have been wont to say that metaphysics is a disease of language....... and so is anything else that can be pointed to or described or inferred.  

Mathematics is a disease of language, but it is one thing that holds the world together...... lends it structure.  

I mean we can point to a bird flying through the air, and it is not obvious that mathematics is directly involved.  

But you can’t point to an electron without invoking its wave equation, which necessarily involves imaginary numbers, like the square root of -1...... something doubly difficult to objectify.  

But we don’t have to get into higher mathematics to raise serious questions about the nature of existence.  


1510......... 

We simply have to note that existence implies observation, and that observation, as we could ever imagine it, requires sapience.  

And then, who observes the observer?  See about Wigner’s friend.  Where does the observational buck stop ?  

Conceivably, the Sun could become a supernova, tomorrow.  

What would become of civilization?  Who cares? 

Obviously, Chivo does not.  

Should anyone care? 

What conceivable difference could it make?  

Ours might well be the only civilization in the universe.  

Where does that leave the universe? 

Who would care? 

There are alleged to be infinitely many unobservable universes out there........ this has become the standard view in physics.  

Who is to question the existential status of an unobservable universe?  

Certainly not your typical physics professor.  


1600........ 

However, are we not social animals?  Most of us find it difficult to not care........ a little bit.  

If existence is social, by that much is it relative.  

Relative to what?  

There is the question...... if you have ever entertained a question.  

But most of us know a little bit about Darwin........ and so we find it easy to put such questions out of our mind.  

Metaphysics........ bah, humbug........ 

Deep down, Chivo can go..... bah, humbug...... 

Isn’t that what Stoics do?  

But, certainly, all of us have had our moments....... of caring about something....... even if only a fleeting moment of self consciousness.  

I speak to such moments........ please, forgive me..... lest I offend.  

But so what....... if existence is relative?  

Could I take that fact to the bank?  


1850.........

Is there not a center of relativity? 

There do seem to be historical centers.  

There is an eternal center in each of us.  

But can we sit down and have a beer with Eternity?  

The best possible God might be the least possible God, whatever that might be.  

But all of us experience moments of solace in an almighty.  

Can our shared judgement be totally misplaced?  

I’m not an absolutist....... such moments cannot be absolutely misplaced.  

There is a personal cosmic force that can be with us....... with  each and every one of us...... personally...... just don’t ask me to explain it...... it can only be experienced.    


2200......... 

I confess that I don’t even have a schematic for the immaterial origin of objects.  As far as I get is the formation of multiple personalities.  

These are able to maintain a psychic or dimensional separation, in lieu of ‘physical’ bodies.  

One might imagine rituals to promote and maintain these separations that would have involved interpersonal identifiers and boundary markers of some sort.  

This might have been what was really going on with the primordial megalithic structures......... the maintenance of individual identities relative to the consensual structures.  

All of this would have been part of the outworking/elaboration of the Logos, prior to the emergence of any sort of historical phenomena.  

Time would have been purely cyclical, based only on the rituals. 

Not to fear........ there is more than ample room for improvement, here!   



(cont........) 
.

To each his own.

Vigorous dialogue I feel is worth it.

It is interesting to know what motivates people.

I guess until you are here, you are distracted.

I don’t know anything, I mean anything other than this.

It seems simple, obvious really, after awhile.

I only ask you because I know your search is not casual.

You have literally put your ass where your mouth goes.

Most folks out in this water are fairly abnormal and maybe crazy, me included.

What does one have to offer others?

Just being able to sit with others around the fire I feel.

Just being here.

So many opinions about being to be found from others.

Until one begins to formulate their own, they just can’t appreciate the work people have done.

The value of the work was most beneficial to the one who did the work.

We work until we realize how to fly with little effort.

How can I thank those who showed me it was worth digging deep and not lying to myself.

I benefited from their example flying.

But the work and benefit only bring you back to ground, to zero.

From there your real work begins.

This still is some of the best wisdom, the dude abides it all with a smile and shining his bowling bowl up real nice.

1450z..........

Strictly speaking, then, I don’t believe in the I Am........ it would have to be a We Are.  

The I can only emerge out of a pre-existing We.  

There is an inclusive cosmic consciousness, which would include totemic and other inter subjective components.  

It could be transpersonal but not supra personal. 

The primordial, totemic zodiac would give way to a more personal Olympiad.  

Some aboriginal cultures are able to maintain this closeness to the animal kingdom, via its personified archetypes or totems, rather than with individual animals.  

Many geographic features would be included in this panoply, which would also be extended to the sky.  

Individual sapient, persons gradually emerge from the cosmic We..... all in harmony with the geographic features, animal totems and ritual temples, etc.... 

This provides a phylogeny, but does not yet yield an ontogeny or embryology.  

There cannot be a hunting and gathering until reproduction is included....... the birds and the bees.......   

Reproduction is the lynchpin of metabolism. 

And we can’t very well have sunflowers without a Sun .  

It would be helpful to have a cosmic Noah’s ark, as in back from the future. 

The possibility of the best possible world must somehow be included in the Logos Spermatikos....... speaking of time machines, and Noah’s arks.  

Yes, Creation is a bootstrap process...... the imagination would figure mightily.  

Everything is happening everywhere and when...... prior to the emergence of relatively stable space/time frame.  

The Source and Telos emerge out of this primordial pleromic panoply.  

History sorts itself out.  


1600......... 

History sorts itself out...... 

And we have access to Eternity and to the sorting process.  

This access is mediated through our unconscious....... personal and collective....... and through our imaginations.  

But, rest assured, this process is not open to our individual willfulness. 

In other words, every moment of time is a microcosm, of which, with the backward directedness of our memory, we have a very lopsided view.  

But, yes, we are time machines, where the dials are a bit rusty. 

With access to portals, our dials become more limber.  


1640.......

I’m watching Mishlove interviewing Bernard Carr...... Hyperspace, Consciousness..........

In the last few minutes, Bernie finally gets around to the notion of a collective phenomenal space.  

I want to shake him by the neck and say, yes, it’s a small world, isn’t it, Bernie? 

But, no, that leap is only a lover’s leap...... a fool’s leap, and Bernie and Jeffrey are both trying to keep up the appearance of intellectual respectability...... and leave little chick alone to his own devices.  

Yes, we have a collective unconscious, so why not a collective consciousness as well?  

Like penguins jostling each other on the edge of the ice cliff, before one of them gets pushed in, and then they all go....... come on in, water is great.  


1940........... 

It is stunning, the degree to which we have relinquished our common sense to the imposed authority of science.  

Our common sense being that our existence is not merely a happenstance.  

But, yes, there is also a coherence to the scientific worldview that is entirely oblivious to our having any place in the world.  

Is this impersonal coherence a deliberate ploy on the part of our higher selves?  I can’t see another explanation.  

We had to pull the cosmic wool over our own eyes, in order orchestrate a proper finale to our Earthly sojourn.  

The scientific coherence is a proper end unto itself..... we cannot vouchsafe that.  There is a pure art to naturalism just in and of itself. 

The logic of science provides its own sub bootstrap that is the logical corollary our larger one....... it is its own self fulfilling prophecy...... as scientists stare into the foggy mirror of nature.  

Yes, scientists are discovering their own constructs in a rather large scale version blind man’s bluff. 



(cont.......) 
.

The Chicken came home to Roost. With a Weller he did KwF Boost. With an Amazon he produced. Then in a flash he Vamoosed.

1220z.........

Yes, there was the procurement of a soldering iron.


1250.......

But, speaking of soldering, let’s get back to the tyranny of atoms ......... 

It is very easy to land yourself a PhD, especially in the sciences, and never once come across the notion of consciousness in any course work, not to mention in the rest of your life.  

In the meantime we have the tyranny of viruses 🦠.  

Am I suggesting that viruses 🦠 are fake news?  

Am I suggesting that if viruses didn’t already exist, we would have had to invent them....... and probably did, in any case? 

I am saying that viruses arose in that auxiliary/logical dimension of time...... paleontologists speak of molecular clock time, which may not be congruent with historical/phenomenal time.  

Poor Owen Barfield, he is the only author/academic who has (even semi-) systematically called into question the dimension of time beyond or outside of consciousness.  And, mind you, Owen is a poet.  

Did God have to plant every fossil and microbe?  

That is what the fundamentalists used to suggest.  God would do that just to lead the smarty pants astray....... would he need a better reason?  


1350......... 

Doesn’t cosmic mind have a mind of its own?  Isn’t that what we call God?  Or do we call it Nature? 

Well, let’s see....... I guess I’m suggesting that we lay down the dots, and the Logos connects them.  

We make the outline, and the Logos fill in the details....... fractal fashion.  

But aren’t we part of that fractal....... aren’t we just the little bot that you see in a Mandelbrot?  

Yes and no.  

Do keep in mind that God is part of the self-same fractal...... all part of the magical bootstrap that we call Creation..... or Nature..... depending on which side of bed you get out on.  

But, remind us, who is this mysterious Logos?  

Good question, I guess.  

It has been said that the Logos is the word of God, and, in the form of the jguy,  the word has been with God since the beginning.  You know....... trinitarianism and all that..... the word made flesh, etc...... 



(cont.......) 
.

https://vrevealed.com/viewing/zachbush/

And what if We arose from viruses?

What if We don't need any stupid vaccines?

Hobbit

1410z........

Wait a minute, little hobbit........ 

Have you never updated the software on your phone or tablet? 

Every time you do an update, you are basically re-vaccinating your smart device.   

Or doesn’t that count?

But, no, I’m putting the horse before the cart....... viruses 🦠 came out of our heads...... just like everything else...... hardware, software.... it’s all the same....... part of that primordial Logos, of which chick is the just latest incarnation, didn’t we all know?  

Yes, I’m just priming the cosmic mind pump....... it just needs a little goose , every now and then.  


1440........ 

You can also think of the Logos as the cosmic Ommm......... of which we are all just overtones and undertones.  

I’m sure that your uncle Fibonacci would have had something to say about that.   

Yes, there are fractal sounds...... fractals came from the study of noise on the phone lines....... where self similarity made an early appearance.  

And we all have a microcosmic self similarity to the primordial Ommm/Logos.  

You can also think of the ten thunders of Finnegan’s Wake....... eg. 

bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonnerronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenthurnuk

hey, look them up.....

I mean, really, to suggest that we are the products of viruses 🦠, is more than a little pernicious..... although it has just become the mental reflex of modernism.  

This materialist mental reflex is just one of the symptoms of our slumber of materialism.  

One of those thunder claps is about to wake us up..... or it may just be that the Princess falls asleep at the portal switch...... bless her ever alert heart.  

All ye, all ye, in free....... it’s dinner time back at the ‘ol Telos..... and, yes, we are for dinner...... we are the piece de resistance...... 

Yes, there was a reason for our being here, and playing this game of hide and seek....... we all have our place....... but is it at the table or on the table?!  Hey, does it make any difference in the End?  



(cont........) 
.

One reflection to another...

All journeys are outward journeys, there is no inward journey. How can you journey inwards? You are already there, there is no point in going. When going stops, journeying disappears; when desiring is no more clouding your mind, you are in. This is called turning in. But it is not a turning at all, it is simply not going out.

So who is speaking and what needs to be said?

Only reflections chatter.

Our public images are just hand crafted myths.

That’s what I play on OMF for, I am merry and myth making.

Are you here merrymaking Dan?

Me thinks you might be crazy and take the reflection a little too seriously, but you can white knuckle it if you like.

That is amusing as well.

You look into the mirror, you are not just the mirror.

We speaking are just the chattering monkey reflections of nothing.

Put that in your disclosure pipe and smoke it.

Joe don’t know that.

And foot certainly doesn’t.

All your words are nothing.

And you are a fart, accept it, doesn’t matter really, the wind will still blow you away.

I’m just teasin being me.

As I was reading the twitter feeds of lunatics and morons, I had a wave of compassion for Trump.

Jim Gaffigan blew up at trumpers and I was like YAH and then immediately I felt, who are you to judge anything?

He wasn’t laughing anymore.

Because I was open and receptive I guess.

What I felt was great pain.

Incredible pain and fear, the same I used to feel.

It was heavy.

I begged for it to leave me.

But it won’t.

I couldn’t even tease the orange  kickball.

I just felt it.

Oh man.

They fear their death.

They would destroy the world from their fear.

The non-trumpers aren’t off the hook.

This just is what it is.

We are what we are.

This push to change is a running away from ourselves.

The left runs to some social utopia.

The right runs into the hands of the great father and mother.

They long for daddy and mommy to love them.

Everyone running around screaming  their muppet heads off and nothing but us here is listening.

We live on this beautiful little blue dot

You can never guess what was happening from 100 miles up.

You will just see the missles silently rising and falling while we snuff our small voice out.

Part of me would at least appreciate an ending.

Truly we are insane.

Driven so by great pain.

That is what I feel today.

I can’t offer any consultation.

It’s like that.

But this isn’t my burden to carry.

It can only be carried by all of us until we can let it go.

I can only watch it.

I can’t change it.

I can’t change myself.

Much less anyone else.

It isn’t very funny anymore all of a sudden.

I feel sadness.

I will let myself feel compassion and sadness and pain.

This is worth all of that.

It can take all my atoms apart.

I am not myself it appears.

I feel swept up in a deluge of sadness.

But it is not my sadness.

It is an artificial construct.

Perhaps a side effect of all the anger.

Sadness and anger seem to go hand in hand.

But I am not angry.

But there is anger.

I am not sad.

But there is sadness.

Hmmmm, strange feelings.

All of a sudden this popped up...



Is this what no self is?

Tossed around on a sea of emotions?

One may appreciate the silence one can find given such a reality.

One may seek to hide in bliss.

I see through bliss.

I am not bliss or sadness.

I am silence.

That seems very odd to write.

A koan.

If I am silence, what is speaking and who is seeking and tweaking?

I guess I’ll never really know this side of the mirror.

That’s enough to drive one crazy.

So I guess it’s back to my  I go.

It’s crazy out there

My fear is their is no where to hide.

I guess I can only abide.

Marcus just slapped me and said...

“be a man worthy of the universe that gave you birth.”

Big mouth stoics

Dan, what would a child do with the secret of being?

Juggle



Cain killed Abel

Able saved Cain

So Dan
, is this what Your friend Gates has planned with this plandemic?????
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/heavily-censored-video-the-corona-vaccine-is-planned-population-reduction_fazvU2Xrqqtxrxp.html?fbclid=IwAR3w7t1V5ydZFbvwQdY6BTRGS2dS6dZD0IQOQoefaIhTS_bgVT94tpGoBUk


Hobbit

There is an interesting conjunction of Dan’s Eschatology, Trump, Russia, Heidegger, UFOs and Dugin.

I’m sure they are all working together.

Consider this is happening now too and I think the UFO disclosure thang is pro Russia or a trap for them.

Putin feels America is Carthage and “Carthage must be destroyed” As Cato always would say. They wish us nothing but destruction.

Russia partly feels it will create a new Eurasian state where Germany, Tokyo and Iran will support it. “For Aleksander Dugin as for Heidegger, by contrast, rationality less uncovers the truth of things than uproots its adherents from the true sources of existential significance which reveal themselves through other, more primordial means.

Dugin for his part thus enthusiastically embraces Heidegger’s monolithic depiction of the course of Western culture after Socrates as one of unending decline, ending in today’s gilded but ‘nihilistic’ age.

“The contemporary West is universal, but in the way that decomposition and death are universal,” the Russian thinker ponders. “Heidegger saw the most profound form of this degeneracy in ‘Americanism’, which he thought of as ‘planetarism’ (today we would say ‘globalism’ and ‘globalization’).”

If the tenor of these sayings already sounds as much prophetic as philosophical, this is not by chance.  For Dugin, “Heidegger is … an eschatological figure, … the final interpreter … of the deepest and most enigmatic themes of world philosophy and the creator of a radically new thinking.”

What Russia needs, says Dugin, is a “genuine, true, radically revolutionary and consistent, fascist fascism.” Its horizon is nothing less than what political theorist Eric Voegelin called the “immanentizing of the eschaton”. As Dugin directly enjoins us:

‘The end times and the eschatological meaning of politics will not realize themselves on their own. We will wait for the end in vain … If the Fourth Political Practice is not able to realize the end of times, then it would be invalid. The end of days should come, but it will not come by itself. This is a task, it is not a certainty. It is an active metaphysics. It is a practice.’

“It is especially important to introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity,” Dugin was advising Russian elites as early as the 1990s, laying out what looks like a blueprint for the kinds of activities presently under CIA investigation:

encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the US. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics …“

Well, smelly goat has cancelled the Eschaton.

Sound familiar?

We have two apocalyptic cults of nuts in the West and East trying to trigger the end of history.

Fundamentalism is a disease, a cancer. Horrible smell, smells like death, like being lined up like cattle and a bolt shot in our head.

Hey Putin, yuh ain’t the only one who knows Cato and sees what’s happening.

I wonder if UFO lore is just a Russian operation to undermine us from within.

Of course it is.

You think the smelly goat is dumb?

Maybe.

Putin and Dugin do not speak in aphorisms, I see no quality in Putin besides being a killer, he has no honor. Their goals are dark and evil and doomed. Trump supports them, period. If he could be the leader of the American extension of Putin’s Antichristic agenda, he will do all he can to make it happen.

And truly America is blinded apparently supernaturally, but it’s just effective propaganda.

America’s exceptionalism was always an illusion.

We are each exceptional only when we take responsibility for ourselves.

Now is the time to meet on common ground.

I don’t support these sick delusions of old communists and mystics who want to end the world.

They can get off anytime they like.

Dugin loves and supports Trump through Bannon, partly I’m sure why he is being dealt with.

Isn’t it ironic, the great threat was not the Q deep state, but their own GOD Trump and Q itself selling them out as he grabs as much power as he can for his final push.

If he wins the next 4 years, it’s gloves off.

If you think somehow this is god’s work, you would be very wrong.

This was and always will be about power.

The GOP doesn’t have policies, they fight to kill.

There is a Great War being waged behind the scenes and it’s now in the streets.

It is gonna get much worse most likely.

Are you really paying attention to what is really happening?

—

“All too often, history is driven by the mad passions and ambitions of tyrants—and by warped visions of “progress” crafted in the shadows behind their thrones.”

I have gotten to the bottom of Dugin’s thought. He feels America is the Anti-Christ and the snakes head needs to be cut off. So Russia is allied with Islam.

This is about resources.

Dugin thinks the Logos is corrupted and the Russian language and thinking can save it "To make an appeal to chaos is the only way to save Logos. Logos needs a savior".

He is immanetizing the Eschaton with Trump?

Trump must scare them.

He is not shameable.

No kompromat would work on him.

You would have to manipulate his ego and greed then.

It may be Trump has us all fooled.

The antichrist would be good at that.

Dugin says the Logos needs a savior.

Listen to this guy.

Logos needs a savior and he’s it?

Imma tell you, Logos needs nothing.

Thank you Mr. Dugin!

What would the smelly goat do without your kind?

Shrug.

BTW, conspiracy theory stoking is key to their destabilization program.

I guess smelly is the last patriot.

He doesn’t fight for a country or a side or good or evil.

He sounds into the wild...baaaaaa baaaaaa flaaahhhhh flaaahhhhh

That’s goat for, where is the good grass.

Recommend Dugin Against Dugin: A Traditionalist Critique of the Fourth Political Theory https://www.amazon.com/dp/1597312193/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_kwgtFb43ETH57

1640z......... 

Chivo, 

Yes, Aleksandr Dugin takes the West to task for having misappropriated the Logos in the name of science and capitalism.  

To put life back into the Logos, Dugin invokes Dionysus....... going to another extreme.  

But, yes, the Logos in the West became the solar Logos, or strictly Apollonian.  

There is also the lunar side of the Logos, to which the BPWH appeals. 

Presumably it is the portals, which, besides our unconscious, connect these two sides.  

On this side we have the consensual world of geography.  

The other side is ruled mainly by idiosyncrasy.  

Each portal may have its own, more or less, indigenous set of phenomena, which generally do not lend themselves to cartography.  

And portals have only a very loose association with the geography on this side....... entanglement being a decidedly interpersonal phenomenon.  

I was hoping to say that geography was just the manifestation of our interpersonal consensus........ but then what happens on the other side?  

Did consensus just go out the window?  

This side is decidedly 3+1-dimensional, while the other side is inter dimensional.  

As we make more use of the other side, in these Endtimes, will it ‘flatten’ out, into something more mappable?  

Its jungle trails turn into superhighways with vistas?  

This is exactly what the Princess is concerned to avoid.  


1820........

This is to suggest that the Earth did not form spontaneously, out of the collective unconscious.  

What could be said of its geology would also likely apply to its paleontology.  

It is the other side that is reportedly more spontaneous and ad hoc.  

We should point out that all those jungle trails will lead eventually to the Source, provided that you follow the light....... as you will, ultimately and necessarily.  

This is to suggest that there is safety in numbers....... in consensual navigation, up to a point, as with a migrating flock of birds.  


2040........ 

It would be the likely fact that all the migration back to the Source does not leave indelible (psychic) ‘footprints’ on the ‘landscape’ is what would require explanation.  



(cont.......) 
.

The princess element still feels unnatural to me and a bolt on that does not compute, as do portals.

I don't know what you are talking about at all with your portal descriptions.

If folks have been using them, I don't know anything about that or have a comment.

You guys have a personal relationship, so only you can speak about that.

But now that I understand Dugin and his philosophical foundations, I think I can do him better maybe

I feel he's wrong.

But who listens to philosophical smelly goats

The better move would be to perhaps stand down the conflict with Russia, China and work together.

As with all apparent problems on earth, we have to focus on the common ground and ignore the nonsense.

The Arrival movie accomplished this using time as a secret weapon to cross our apparent social and cultural boundaries.

No one trusts anyone atm in public.

Everyone is focused on hating each other.

This is like nothing I have ever seen, you went through the 60s, but this is terrifying to the common muppet.

Smelly doesn't hate anyone.

It is no small thing to understand Dugin and why he feels as he does publically anyway, I am quite impressed with myself figuring it all out.

It might be worth another book.

It would be funny a no one like me writing and publishing a philosophy book on Dugin, but then I would be known and I don't want to be known be anyone really

Guess I will just watch.

1440z.......

I don’t know that anyone has proof of the paranormal, or, even if they did have the means, whether they would be willing or able to deploy that proof in public.  

It is a very fair assumption that Disclosure has already been orchestrated, however.  

In the meantime, we just maintain our protocols.  

Everything I say is premised on this being a small and personal world.  

Human history is based upon a Metanarrative, with an Alpha and Omega.  

The Alpha and Omega are portals relative to the Source/Telos.  

The Metanarrative covers the phenomenal dimension of time...... or the 6-8 thousand years of (linear) recorded history.  

The background of the phenomenal is the logical dimension of time, which includes all of Nature, and which is directly embedded in Eternity.  

If we take Owen Barfield’s model, he refers to linear history as beta (ego) consciousness, which is preceded and succeeded by regimes of original and final participation, respectively.  

A good description of original participation is the aboriginal Dreamtime.  

The transition from Dreamtime to ego consciousness is referred to by Julian Jaynes as the breakdown of the bicameral mind.   

Original participation is a tribal participation.  

Final participation is a global participation, mediated initially by the internet.  


1520........ 

What is happening now politically, with Steve Bannon out in front globally, is a reversion to tribal thinking.  

This is the low road to final participation...... populist agitators will have their heyday.  

The Catholic Church should know better...... well, it does, but doesn’t know quite what to do about it.   

I suspect that stevie and foot have interacted around these issues.  

Some sort of cosmic trigger is being widely anticipated.  

This trigger will be closely associated with the reopening of the portals.  

The only question is how far will the tribal chaos be allowed to devolve, prior to this eventuality.  

Clearly we are not far from that threshold..... the threshold of Disclosure/Revelation.  

This would be our metamorphosis....... it would be time to deploy the butterfly, as we emerge from our cosmic cocoon of beta consciousness....... Monadnock or bust.  

Butterfly ......... yes, it may require some assembly...... and the portals will be our assembly stations ....... 

The Princess need not have worried....... the Hive will simply be flyover country.  


1650........ 

As far as I know, Princess and foot are unaware of Monadnock.  

This blind spot would give them a rather truncated view of history.  

Look, ma, no Eschaton.  

Does the same go for all the wannabe dictators out there?  

Many of these strong man types may have access to primordial tribal portals, but they simply don’t care what the larger historical context might be...... as long as their goose keeps laying golden eggs.  

For most of these types, it would be a mirror, mirror on the wall...... kind of situation, just enough intelligence to keep their ship afloat, on barely a daily basis.  

Many practitioners/consumers would not even be aware of the inter dimensional aspect.  

Those who do understand the historical entanglements would not have much incentive, or could even have a negative incentive to broadcast that knowledge....... the coverup...... 

The possibility that the cosmic trigger would kill their golden goose would hardly have registered....... either the trigger or the threat.  


1850......... 

There does not have to be a Disclosure day.   

There could just be a continuing lowering of the inter dimensional barriers....... a continuing erosion of the fortress of scientific materialism.  

There may be pressure on the potus to do a personal Disclosure, and he might do it as a political Hail Mary, if he finds himself backed further into a corner. 

There is the underlying physical/economic fact that there will be physical limits to economic growth....... limits which we are already pressing up against.  

Most of the economic and scientific establishment touts the efficacy of unlimited growth, but behind the notion of unlimited growth is the very strong implication that we are scions of a teleological imperative.  

Darwinism strongly suggests otherwise.  We can’t have it both ways.   

Is the Force with us or not?  

Yes, I believe that the Force is with us, but it’s not a physical force.  It is a metaphysical force, and it is operating in a spiritual dimension.  

Gaining access to the portal/paranormal phenomena is how this force is to be revealed to us.  

This inter dimensional realm is the elephant....... that’s not quite in the room...... we just have to learn how to look around the corner.  

This force is the light that will lead us back to the Source.  

But, yes, this Force, this cornucopia comes with an Eschaton attached. 

At some level everyone is aware that we are facing a cosmic trade off.  

Yes, this will eventually be a gold rush, but all of us, on some level, are aware that this will be the last one.  


2020........ 

Will we not come this way again?  

Yes and no.  

After all, there is only one of us, and that one of us has already been by here........ 10^10 times.  

Would we not have tired of it by now.  We might be better judges of that when the show has finished...... it’s not quite finished, yet.  

The big hill is yet to come....... 



(cont........) 
.

Here I sit
Watching it all go round
Not a worry or care in sight
There is nothing as valuable as knowing
What is the mysterious sense of how things are
Eschaton is a distortion of this deep sense
A materialization of it
Don't be fooled
Or be fooled
Your choice

Good luck Dan and OMF crew.

I wish you all good sailing.

Take care of yourselves and each other.

Sorry my Irish friend not getting a chance to catch up, you know who you are, we really didn't have anything to talk about.

I enjoy finding new emerging voices, artists and cultural creatives and have enjoyed Anna's especially in the context of the "new now" stemming from the Pandemic and a forced shift in consciousness. #firstpost

Thank you, Eric/Chivo........ 

Don’t be a stranger.  We know you will be irreplaceable.  


Fore, 

Yes, Anna does give expression to much of what Chivo has been telling us.

Anna points to the core of Eternity that we all contain within us...... the still quiet center.   

It’s existence deserves all the notice that it can get....... but most of us still have a few miles left before we can sleep....... patience.

1240z....... 

No, it won’t be the same.  

The waves won’t have a rock to crash against.  

Oh, well, life goes on...........
.............. 


1310....... 

Frequently do I suggest that the inter dimensional barriers grow weaker as the orthodoxy of scientific materialism loses its grip upon our imagination.  

We start paying more attention to the things that go bump in the night....... the things that disturb the pall of orthodoxy.  

Our resistance to the anomalous is worn down. 

Before science came along, the Church was our bulwark against interloping entities.  Who will burn the witches, now?  

There is a tendency for us to follow the lead of science, in treating the world around us as something objective....... we being the passive observers.  

Well....... we are and we aren’t.   

True, the best possible world is firmly embedded in Eternity.  

But we, as individuals, are firmly embedded in the temporal flow.  

Much of our imagination is invested in the future.  

Our free will, such as it is, is expressed in its projection onto the future.   


1430........ 

What we may have is a tug of war between our pushing and the Telos pulling........ history is the resultant.  

We get to have our subjective free will, while the cosmic hidden hand maintains its ultimate hegemony.  

If anyone of us gets too far off the intended path, balancing forces come into play.  

Most of our subjective free will remains in the imaginal realm.  

The notion of a cosmic hidden hand sounds rather impersonal.  

That God should operate primarily, anonymously through such a ‘mechanism’, is how we manage to minimize her presence, while affording her maximal leverage.  

Is this not a cosmic optimization?  



(cont........)
.

Foresaperire wrote:

I enjoy finding new emerging voices, artists and cultural creatives and have enjoyed Anna's especially in the context of the "new now" stemming from the Pandemic and a forced shift in consciousness. #firstpost

She has a Tony Parsons/Jim Newman vibe.

1220z.......

Periodically, it is useful to consider how the evidence stacks up for the various philosophies....... 

But before launching into that exercise, we might consider the following problem with immaterialism........ 

In the BPWH version of immaterialism, reality is anthropocentric and geocentric.  If this were the case, how do we account for the astrophysical and geophysical phenomena? 

As a warmup exercise, how do we account for the tree falling in the forest?  

The recognition of this problem goes back at least as far as the limerick, written with Bishop Berkeley in mind......

There was a young man who said "God
Must find it exceedingly odd
To think that the tree
Should continue to be
When there's no one about in the quad."

Reply:
"Dear Sir: Your astonishment's odd;
I am always about in the quad.
And that's why the tree
Will continue to be
Since observed by, Yours faithfully, God."

What a strange world Berkeley would have us in: things entering and exiting our perceptions (that is to say, entering and exiting existence itself, having being one moment and non-being the next). How can this be? Berkeley has a solution.

If things owe their existence to being perceived, and cannot logically pop in and out of existence based on our perceiving them one moment and not the next, then how do we account for their existence apart from our perception of them? Berkeley’s answer is that there’s an Infinite Perceiver, namely God.

Things exist independently from their being perceived by one another because God perceives them all from an infinite perspective.

This problem has been greatly exacerbated by modern astronomy, not to mention the search for extraterrestrial intelligence (SETI).  

There’s a very simple answer that does not require the invocation of God........ we invoke a collective consciousness.  

The answer is simple until we consider SETI.  

At this point, we invoke the finitude implied by personalism.  That finitude argues strongly for a small world and a geocentrism.  

This, in its turn, raises boundary issues...... can there be no limits on collective consciousness in a geocentric world?  

If there were limits, how could those limits be defined or imposed?  

What if we find evidence for a primordial life form on Mars.  Would that not count as evidence against immaterialism and geocentrism?  

Doesn’t the discovery of extra solar planets count as evidence against immaterialism?  And within a few years we might have evidence for the existence of an oxygen atmosphere on one of those planets.  

The BPWH should be easily disprovable.  

Almost any scientist would follow Samuel Johnson who kicked a stone in the path, saying....... I refute the Bishop, thusly!  

The problem of limits, with regard to immaterialism, overlaps with the problem of evidence....... how does the evidence stack up?

Well, in immaterialism, the evidence does not stack...... it only coheres...... how do we compare apples and oranges ?


1400.......

The question really comes down to this......... who should be sleeping easier....... the materialist or the immaterialist?  

Heck, if I were a materialist, I would be seriously sleep deprived.  

The Princess has only to lift her little finger, and materialism is all gone.  

But wait, don’t the materialists have a safety valve....... Cartesian dualism?  

That’s what they are probably thinking....... but they have another think coming.  

If science has done one thing, it has eradicated any basis for mind-body dualism.  

AI, neuroscience and evolutionism have jointly wiped out the boundaries between mind and body, so keep that in mind as we explore the boundary problem for immaterialism.  

We can all understand about the tree in the quad and the tree in the forest, but what about the tree on Mars....... heck, we might find a petrified tree on Mars...... or, if not on Mars, then on Planet X.  

But, like I say, I’m not laying awake nights....... except maybe to see how best to refute it.  

Should we have been surprised to confirm the existence of the dark side of the Moon ?  Not hardly.  

However, finding a fossil microbe 🦠 on Mars...... that might be something else.  

I would have to bet against it.

But wait, haven’t we found microbes embedded in rocks at the bottom of oil wells, miles below the surface?  


1500........

We are talking here about extremophiles and archaea.  

But this brings us back to questions about the origin of life.  

How many origins have there been?  

When I last checked, the biological charts are still showing just one origin.  

There was one last universal ancestor (LUA)...... the primordial Eve.  

Is this fact more favorable to materialism or to immaterialism?  

It is favorable to the miracle of life, and thus to vitalism.  

But wait, doesn’t vitalism argue for the plethora of life, thus to the plethora of life sources.  

Yes and no......

See, vitalism is not about miracles.  Vitalism is impersonal....... miracles involve persons...... do they not?  

In other words, LUA/biological Eve was there because we’re here.  

She speaks directly to us........ or, more likely, we speak to her or through her......... through her footprint.  

So, when LUA/Eve came along, it was not just any old tree in the forest......... she was already wearing our ring.  

LUA was not part of our phenomenal history....... she was, almost literally, our Logos Spermatikos........ she was the ‘physical’ equivalent thereof.  

Vitalism argues for Panspermia.  

Immaterialism argues for the Logos Spermatikos......... big difference.  

Logos Spermatikos does not grow on trees.  

Trees grow on the Logos Spermatikos.  

Everything grows on the I Am.  


1610.......

Yes, drama lovers , the BPWH was a gleam in the eye of the I Am.  

In a strong sense, it all goes back to John Wheeler and the participatory universe........ the universe wouldn’t be there, if we weren’t here.  

And where are we........ we are on the best possible rare Earth.  

No, the Earth is not rare...... the Earth is singular.  

Life on Mars.........

I’m skeptical, and maybe more than just a little bit skeptical 🤨.  

I’m a personalist, not a vitalist.  


1650.........

Ok, Princess , the fact that the world is blue proves that God is a person.  

How?

Because animals are color blind

That doesn't explain how God is a person?

We are created in that image

How do you know we are created?

We are not here by accident

Why are we here

Who else could appreciate the blueness of the world
That's why we're here
Praise the lord
If you were Lord, Princess, would you want to play to empty bleachers?
Yes, the bleachers seem a bit crowded, but I don't think they are too crowded....... especially not if we're all here to see the grand finale!!

I’m sure that there are skeptics out there, who will point out that animals are often not colorblind.  

Well, they are and they aren’t........

Technically, animals can see colors.  

They respond to colors behaviorally, but not aesthetically...... not poetically.  

There is a difference........ pace Fred Skinner.  


1830............

It looks like chick might have won his first metaphysical argument with the Princess ....... just sayin......

Mind you, this is the first argument since fisticuffs, several years ago.  


0030..........

Me thinks the Princess was feeling sorry for me....... she pitched me a meatball....... the chick could use a little charity.  

There was truly no argument...... it was just presented as an easy challenge for and old man.  



(cont.......) 
.

1500z.........

Immaterialism has a boundary problem, particularly if it is geocentric.  

Are the rocks on Pluto just as solid as the rocks in your backyard?  

I don’t have an explanation for the solidity of the rocks in my backyard.  

Science has an explanation, however, it is anything but straightforward.  

That explanation involves the fact that electrons are identical relativistic Dirac particles, whose wave functions have to be rotated through 720 degrees before they return to their initial value.  

Unlike Bose particles, only one Dirac particle may occupy a particular quantum state at a given time.  This exclusion principle is what makes matter relatively impenetrable.  

This principle is just a very minor facet of the much more general Anthropic Principle.  

Suppose the Viking craft had not been sent to Pluto.  What would be the ontological status of its geology?  

What will be the ontological status of the alleged myriad of unobservable extra Solar planets........ or the ontological status of the alleged myriad of unobservable universes?  

And what, if any, should be the import of such hypothetical questions?  

The import is that they present conceptual conundrums for an immaterialist.  


1640.........

Materialism has its boundaries, as, say, with the quantum realm, but these boundaries are well mapped out and relatively contained.  

With immaterialism, the observer problem is less well defined..... it is more ubiquitous.  

One may attempt to surmount aspects of the observer problem by postulating a collective consciousness corresponding to an inter subjective field or simply cosmic consciousness.  

It is far from clear how such a cosmic consciousness would relate to the classical space-time manifold, or how it might conform to a geocentric model.  

How are the panoply of astronomical phenomena generated, if not actually produced by all the objects postulated by astrophysics?  A simple enough question to be posed by the materialist.  

The radical alternative is to suggest that scientific phenomena are somehow dredged out of the collective psyche of the scientific community.  Such is manifestly the case with mathematical objects.  

If this were the case, shouldn’t there be some way to demonstrate it?  

If space and time are produced in the same fashion, one might have a hard time spying out any anomalies, beyond those which occur ‘spontaneously’.   

Scientific phenomena have a retrospective coherence, which suggests a teleological dimension, a dimension which appears in all aspects of our world.  

The basic idea is that Nature abhors a vacuum, or a blank sky, for that matter.  

Over the millennia, the human psyche has projected itself upon that canvas....... all the way from astrology to the very latest in quantum cosmology.  The projection of mathematics holds everything together.  

And do keep in mind that our collective psyche has had all eternity to smooth out the rough edges.  

So what would this model of the cosmos say are the prospects for exobiology, for instance?  

This is where the Logos Spermatikos meets Panspermia.......

My money is on the Logos.  

The Moon is not made of green cheese....... it is composed of our collective psyche. Tell that to your kids.



(cont........)
.