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» Disclosure - For U by U
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Yesterday at 10:08 pm by U

» Why are we here?
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Yesterday at 8:31 pm by Post Eschaton Punk

» The scariest character in all fiction
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» WRATH OF THE GODS/TITANS
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Fri Nov 15, 2024 12:16 am by U

» Uanon's Majikal Misery Tour "it's all smiles on the magic school bus"
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Sun Nov 10, 2024 9:36 pm by Mr. Janus

» What Music Are You Listening To ?
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Sat Nov 09, 2024 12:34 am by U

» Livin Your Best Life
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Wed Nov 06, 2024 8:55 am by Post Eschaton Punk

» OMF STATE OF THE UNION
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Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:19 am by U

» Baudrillardian hauntology - what are some haunting truths to our reality?
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Sun Nov 03, 2024 3:07 pm by dan

Where did all the Open Minds Forum members go?

Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:29 pm by Admin

With Open Minds Forum restored now for almost half a year at it's new location with forumotion.com we can now turn to look at reaching out to OMF's original members who have not yet returned home. OMF's original membership was over 6,000 members strong, prior to the proboards suspension, according to the rolls of the time. We can probably safely assume that some of those accounts were unidentified socks. If we were to assume a reasonable guess of maybe as many as 30% possible sock accounts then that would leave potentially somewhere between 4800 to 4900 possible real members to locate. That is still a substantial number of people.

Who were all these people? Some were average individuals with common interests in ufology, exopolitics, globalism, corruption, earthchanges, science and technology, and a variety of other interests. Some just enjoyed being part of a vibrant and unusually interesting community. Others were representative of various insider groups participating in observation and outreach projects, while still others were bonafide intelligence community personnel. All with stake in the hunt for truth in one fashion or another. Some in support of truth, and communication. Others seeking real disclosure and forms of proof. And others highly skeptical of anything or limited subjects. The smallest division of membership being wholly anti-disclosure oriented.

So where did these members vanish to? They had many options. There are almost innumerable other forums out there on the topics of UFO's or Exopolitics, the Unexplained, and Conspiracy Theory. Did they disappear into the world-wide network of forum inhabitants? Did some go find new homes on chatrooms or individual blogs? Did they participate in ufo conventions or other public events and gatherings? How about those who represented groups in special access? Or IC and military observers? Those with academic affiliations? Where did they all go and what would be the best way to reach out and extend an invitation to return?

And what constitutes a situation deserving of their time and participation? Is the archive enough? How exactly do people within the paradigm most desire to define a community? Is it amenities, humanity or simply population size for exposure? Most of the special guests have been emailed and have expressed that population size for exposure is what most motivates them. But not all. Long-time member Dan Smith has other priorities and values motivating his participation. Should this open opportunities for unattached junior guests who have experience and dialog to contribute to the world? How best to make use of OMF's time, experience and resources?

Many skeptics would like to see the historical guardian of discourse opportunity to just up and disappear; go into permanent stasis. They think that not everyone has a right to speak about their experiences and if there is no proof involved then there can philosophically be no value to discourse. I personally would respectfully disagree with them. Discourse has always been the prelude to meaningful relationships and meaningful mutual relationships have always been the prelude to exchanges of proof. In a contentious social environment with regards to communication vs disclosure how do we best re-establish a haven for those preludes? Is it only the "if we build it they will come" answer? Well considering OMF has been largely fully functional over the last four or five months this line of reasoning is not necessarily true. So what would be the best way re-establish this? Your suggestions are sought. Please comment.

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Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

GSB/SSR: Special Guest; Posts : 658
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Post n°1

Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:10 am

First topic message reminder :

And for the insane, or other wise, we present:

Schroedinger's Cat is not Alone

http://arxiv.org/pdf/1004.4206v4

Beatriz Gato, Beatriz Gato-Rivera
(Submitted on 23 Apr 2010 (v1), last revised 31 Mar 2011 (this version, v4))
We introduce the `Complete Wave Function' and deduce that all living beings, not just Schroedinger's cat, are actually described by a superposition of `alive' and `dead' quantum states; otherwise they would never die. Therefore this proposal provides a quantum mechanical explanation to the world-wide observation that we all pass away. Next we consider the Measurement problem in the framework of M-theory. For this purpose, together with Schroedinger's cat we also place inside the box Rasputin's cat, which is unaffected by poison. We analyse the system identifying its excitations (catons and catinos) and we discuss its evolution: either to a classical fight or to a quantum entanglement. We also propose the BSVΨ scenario, which implements the Complete Wave Function as well as the Big Bang and the String Landscape in a very (super)natural way. Then we test the gravitational decoherence of the entangled system applying an experimental setting due to Galileo. We also discuss the Information Loss paradox. For this purpose we consider a massless black cat falling inside a massive black hole. After that we outline a method to compute the contribution of black cats to the dark matter of the universe. Finally, in the spirit of Schroedinger, we propose that next generation double-slit experiments should use cats as projectiles. Cat interferometry will inevitably lead to the `Many Cats' interpretation of Quantum Mechanics, allowing to shed new light on old mysteries and paradoxes. For example, according to this interpretation, conservative estimates show that decision making of a single domestic cat will create about 550 billion whole universes every day, with as many replicas of itself.

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Post n°501

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:06 pm

Hold yer hosses ... "all info is physical"? What about if you make stuff up? Eg, Plato and his forms ... those forms are physical?!

Yep! But they also really exist, outside of space and time and change. But thinking about them is a physical process happening in spacetime, where they are 'represented' ...

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Post n°502

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:13 pm

Well, all of this is certainly implausible, but there's no denying it! The cat(fish) is out of the bag, but has the sun(son?)fish left the aquarium? And where exactly did Elvis go after he left the building?

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skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°503

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:15 pm

"Yep! But they also really exist, outside of space and time and change. But thinking about them is a physical process happening in spacetime,"

You're absolutely sure of that? I wonder if there is a proof for it. Or is it more of a "he said, she said" kind of deal?

dan

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Post n°504

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:41 am

From: Dan
Date: June 26, 2014, 10:34:52 AM EDT
To: "Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike"
Cc: Ron
Subject: Teleocracy......

Anthony,

Yes, we do need a theocracy or, more accurately a teleocracy.

Yes, the 3rd Reich had the trappings of Millennialism, but I see very little of a favorable comparison between Adolph and Jesus. Do you?

Is your imagination so limited, Anthony, that you can think of no way that God could, with one hand tied behind his back, turn our little spaceship around on a dime?

Do you really think that we humans have the power to thwart God's Plan of salvation?

At least you got it part right, Hitler, like all the rest of us, was caught up in the Plan. The more you try to resist, the tighter becomes the harness.

And why do you say 2030? Don't you want the Lord to hurry?

Now, I will endeavor to explain to you the Teleocracy.........

On Jun 26, 2014, at 1:35 AM, "Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike" wrote:

Global Theocratic Movement

St Anthony - saving the universe one planet at a time

Dan, you're obviously a philosopher and a thinker with all these rapid fire questions. There are, however, some very real problems regarding the whole Second Coming scenario which basically centre on Jesus revolutionary idea of not killing your enemies. In practical terms, however, this philosophy appears not to work; although, theoretically its possible that your enemies could become your friends if you don't pull out a gun and try to kill them. However, my observation of capitalists and demo(n)crats is that no matter how much you preach to them, they don't change ie. however much you preach to the Devil he doesn't change. Okay, back to basics, there would need to be a culling of the herd to bring the earth's population down to a manageable level of around 500 million as per Georgia Guidestones. God, however, is reticent to wipe out 6 billion demo(n)crats even though the Book of Revelation demands it. The paradigm shift would require 6 billion demo(n)crats to give up capitalism and become theocrats which is highly unlikely as everyone likes to have their shiny new gizmos. N.B. Hitler was a Messiah, but was fighting against overwhelming odds. He knew, however, that Britain and America wanted a war to get themselves out of the Great Depression ie. Hitler would not be so foolish as to take on the whole world singlehandedly and expect to win, but the whole world took him on and won. N.B. The Devil does not believe Jesus will come back which is why he's so confident the world will remain under his control ie. will remain demo(n)cratic. However, if Jesus does come back, yes, there would have to be the Battle of Armageddon where all Antichrist forces are wiped out. The problem is that the Second Coming now appears to be a very remote possibility which leaves only the people themselves to make any necessary changes, but they are so dumbed down chipped up and saturated with toxins that for them to make that change is extremely remote if not impossible. Present calculations put the Second Coming on Thurs 30th May 2030, but other preliminary events still have not taken place which means the likelihood of the Second Coming is now very remote indeed, but cannot be ruled out entirely.
Yours in the battle for planet earth,
Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike (UK)
Cosmic Research Foundation
Markapur, A.P. 523316, India
E-Mail cosmicrf@hotmail.com
Tel 91-8596-224312/9959-684635
Date 26th June 2014

From: Dan
To: Anthony
Cc: Ron
Subject: Paradigm Shift
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2014 16:06:53 -0400

Anthony,

Is it not fair to say, however, that Hitler turned out to be a false Messiah? Are you quite sure that there will have to be a physical Armageddon before the arrival of God's kingdom? Does God not have the power to bring peace on earth through a spiritual awakening by means of, say, the mother of all paradigm shifts?

Dan

From: Dan
Date: June 26, 2014, 11:13:03 AM EDT
To: "Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike"
Cc: Ron
Subject: Re: Teleocracy......

The Teleocracy will be the optimal synthesis of theocracy and democracy. It will be the one natural state of human and cosmic affairs, leading [us] up to the the Telos/Omega, which, yes, will arrive in a thousand years, if not sooner.

Evolutionism is a false form of teleology. It was the (quite deliberate) Strong Delusion that lead us into the Great Apostasy, which was reductive (scientific) materialism. We are about to experience the finale of this cosmic Bait & Switch operation. Is God stupid, Anthony? Can God outsmart us? Is there the slightest reason to believe that God has not already outsmarted us?

Salvation is a lot like Tom Sawyer's fence painting. God tricked us into saving ourselves. Salvation is 'all-over' now, except for the Shouting. All we need is to find the right person with the right shout-out. We just need the X-man to trigger the MoAPS.

Any suggestions?

From: Dan
Date: June 26, 2014, 12:13:07 PM EDT
To: "Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike"
Cc: Ron
Subject: Re: Teleocracy......

Or, let's put this another way.........

The best and the brightest cannot begin to fathom the subtlety of God. They believe that their detection systems are so effective, that God could not possibly fly under their 'radar'.

Have we got news for them, Anthony?

Or, Anthony, harken to what Ron once told me........ Dan, our very best instrumentation is not able to track the Phenomenon. All that we can do is track those who are implicated in the Phenomenon.

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°505

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Thu Jun 26, 2014 12:16 pm

Oh, this one is good ... it's great: Pike blogs, "there would need to be a culling of the herd to bring the earth's population down to a manageable level of around 500 million ... ".

I like the part that has the word "manageable". What a relief to know that A. there are 500 million humans who are manageable ... where do you find these people? ... and B. a great comfort to know that there is at least one person who is up to managing these 500 million.

A couple other points made by Pike are intriguing: 1. the great event is based on turning the other cheek, and 2. the fatalist aka utilitarian aka mechanist aka robotic aka free will is fantasy aka faith depends on intelligence " The problem is that the Second Coming now appears to be a very remote possibility which leaves only the people themselves to make any necessary changes, but they are so dumbed down chipped up and saturated with toxins that for them to make that change is extremely remote if not impossible".

dan

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Post n°506

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:10 am

Skai,

AG Pike is a trip and half, is he not? Where had Ron been hiding him, all these years? In India, obviously!

St Anthony is a smarter version of Gordon Novel. Neither can breathe, except when on the extreme margins. Birds of a feather.

For the time being, both Chris and Tony have stepped to the sidelines wrt to a continuing correspondence with me. Both of them plead agnosticism wrt the BPWH.

Sam and I had a lenghty convo this morning about my approach to the E2SHI Institute at JHU. He wisely counsels a two-step approach.....

1.) I represent myself as a member of the BGF planning committee looking for future speakers.

2.) When I finally find a likely subject, I pull out my second agenda..... Danianity and D-day.

But then what?, I ask Sam. I don't want to come off as Jeckle and Hyde, now do I? Surprise! Bait and Switch.

It is very hard for me or anyone to pretend to be sane around the Eschaton. No? The harder we try, the more contrived and foolish we look.

All I want to be at JHU, is their eschatological mascot. How harmless is that? And, just as soon as I find a modicum of acceptance, I will move right on to the next school. No fuss, no muss.

Now, as I tried to explain to Sam, R&A have somewhat pulled back and/or they covered their D-day tracks by making it seem as if it were just about the money. Following the money can work both ways. It can also provide the #1 rationale for plausible deniability. Am I wrong about that?

And do keep in mind that probably one-half of this 'deniability' is in the furtherance of my own tenuous grip on sanity. No?

And the other half of the PD.......?

Hey, sports fans, that half is for You! Tell me I'm stupid!

(cont.)

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
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Post n°507

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Fri Jun 27, 2014 8:15 pm

On eschatological cosmologists:

First of all, is there a list of contenders?

Second of all, in that universities are trending towards religious aspects, although different in content than those of their roots, it may well be time to establish a panopolous chair, call it the Chair of Eschatological Cosmology. You'd be taking the bull by the horns, futuristically, since at this point there is no bull yet, but only indications that it's out there in some pasteur chawing away at its cudly cuisine.

Thirdly, the feedlot bulls are limited in their menu choices ... but when they're eventually loosed, whoa dude ... it'll be on.

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
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Post n°508

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Sat Jun 28, 2014 1:05 pm

Correction: "different in content from those ...", not "than".
Acronym: Chair of Eschatological Cosmology, COEC, should be pronounced to sound like a New Yorker would pronounce Captain Kirk ... ie, Captain Koik.

Comment on "insane": Sanity is nothing more than a state of mind.
Comment on "stupid": It only applies to people who buy into it.

dan

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Post n°509

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Sun Jun 29, 2014 12:39 pm

Skai,

I have a much cheaper and quicker alternative........

I appoint myself as eschatological ombudsman and gadfly to the intelligentsia.

That's where I am, as of Friday. Do I have any competition yet?

And how many eschatologies are there, you ask? Only one, Skai, that is coherent and open to rational inquiry. It is the one and only BPWH.

But let me flash forward to SfA/GFC, this morning.......

Bill was not there, so we just had a video on ID by Doug Axe and the
Journal of Bio-Complexity. Standard ID stuff.

Once again I raise the issue of vitalism vs ID. It is a deep issue. Basically it pits the deists against the theists. It is all about teleology.

I well understand that, in God's explicit absence, lo these many years, it is only to be expected that most theists would revert to deism. Who would cast the first stone?

But let's go back to Friday........

I did have an unsusual string of positive reception while looking for E2SHI faculty to buttonhole. The institute has been relatively quiescent in its first couple of years, so I'm able to feel needed, to breathe some new life into it.

My approach is national security, more or less on behalf of Ron and, of course, the President.

I mean the President would really like to be out in front on the major issues, but there is the little matter of the Constitution......

If the only resolution to the global crisis entails a MoAPS, the new paradigm will almost certainly have a metaphysical component, which would render it untouchable by any secular establishment.

Nonetheless, said secular establishment does, by historical necessity, have a dog in this fight, that being our very own Ron, or so I am being allowed to surmise.

And for how long will I be able to get away with this little ruse? Until the first person calls campus security. Then what will the Ronster have to say on my behalf? 'Don't worry, he's harmless, just don't let him drink too much.' They could have a breathalyzer waiting for me.

Is this rocket science or what?

So let's go back to yesterday and Sam's and my sendoff for his H&A intern, Tina. She and I both attend evangelical churches. We were comparing charismatic elements of our respective churches, not much in either case. Then I got onto that other ritual, communion. She was not aware of the sectarian transubstantiation controversies. How many people were killed in the process of sorting out that bit of metaphysics?

Early this morning I was onto incarnation and disincarnation, the latter of which has always been a headache for the BPWH.

Then there is the Logos....... I had forgotten that, in premodern parlance, substance and essence are practically synonymous. And how much difference can there be between the Telos and Logos? And nowadays we have the dichotomy of universals and particulars. I do need to sort these out wrt the BPWH.

Substance theory is what we need to look at.

In the SEP, there is a close connection between subtance and telos..... http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/substance/#SubTel .

(cont.)

dan

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Post n°510

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Mon Jun 30, 2014 12:31 am

From: "Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike"
Date: June 29, 2014, 4:48:41 PM EDT
To: cosmicrfgroup
Subject: Ron Pandolfi Update

Real Wiki Leaks

St Anthony - exposing the lies, revealing the truth

Hi Dan, you do like to throw the cat among the pigeons don't you!! Yer, Ron is a pal of St Anthony on the basis that he was a pal of the late Gordon Novel who regarded St Anthony as his spiritual advisor and confidant on all matters top secret. In fact, Gordon always used to tell me not to tell anyone about all the top secret stuff he was revealing to me knowing full well that I would tell everyone. Ron, therefore, regards me as a spiritual powerhouse whereby he can recharge his batteries which keep getting drained while sitting at his desk pushing a pen for the Company. Yes, you could say Ron is one of the good guys in amongst the bad, but I must admit he is a bit quirky at times especially since he hooked up with his Kashmiri Princess ie. he now has a foot fetish and can't stop kissing and caressing Princess Aliyah's tootsies. He also takes pleasure in washing her underwear which is another kinky fetish of his, but apparently the Princess loves it and keeps removing more of her underwear for him to wash while he gazes on in awe. Okay, that's enough porn for today!! Now, where were we? O yes, the Company. Well, yes, they're very good at killing all the wrong people. That's why JFK said he would smash the CIA into a thousand pieces, but sadly before he could do it, CIA hit-man, Bill Greer, blew JFK's brains out at point blank range with an exploding poison-tipped bullet at www.youtube.com/watch?v=1q91RZko5Gw and if you look closely at the 24 sec marker you'll see Gordon Novel on the grassy knoll necking with his sweetheart, Liz Taylor, so no way could Gordon have been implicated in the murder as Liz's assets kept getting in the way!!
Yours in the battle for planet earth,
Rev Dr Anthony G. Pike (UK)
Cosmic Research Foundation
Markapur, A.P. 523316, India
E-Mail cosmicrf@hotmail.com
Tel 91-8596-224312/9959-684635
Date 30th June 2014

From: Dan
To: Anthony
Cc: Ron
Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2014 14:19:29 -0400

Anthony, Do you consider Ron to be a friend or foe?

Ditto for his employer?

SEP > substance/#SubTel ........

Hey, sports fans, remember when LF and I were in KC with C&GL, at the office with the NasCow, drawing on the whiteboard? Ron was on the other end of the line with the photos.

We were trying to figure the incarnation, a-la CTMU.

So there is the answer, Aristotle had it all along, of course..... #SubTel.

See, maybe Ari and I aren't quite as stupid as we look. Where are Chris and Gina when we need them?

4:10--------

And I'm betting, do I have a choice(?), that SubTel is related to QBism and to weak measurements. Is this rocket science, or what? And what's the frequency, Kenneth?

And, yes, we do need Tononi.

9:45-------

I have looked at Tononi's Integrated Information Theory (IIT) again, and the more I see, the less impressed I am. I don't see anything conceptually new in his completely mechanistic theory. What is new is that he just seems to have more chutzpah/naivete than previous commentators, along with the requisite proportion of formulas. I would like to think this was a joke/hoax, a reverse of Sokal, but, sadly, I think not. Look, I don't mean to speak badly of my feathered friends, but if there is ever going to be a Nerd's theory of the mind, this would be it. Look no further.

Has Guilio never heard of neural networks? Quantum theory? How has he managed to remain totally innocent of philosophy? Yes, there is, amongst the vast majority of scientists, a great disdain for all philosophical discourse. I'm afraid to say that, when we last spoke, even Paul seemed to have been taken in by GT. Paul has much philosophy of physics, but not of the mind, now more evidently, which may explain our own communication impasses.

To all those babes in the woods, I can only wish them Godspeed.

Please, back to #SubTel........

(cont.)

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Post n°511

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Mon Jun 30, 2014 9:15 am

Has Guilio never heard of neural networks? Quantum theory?

Not Wayne's World, but Werbos' World

http://www.werbos.com/

6 MegaChallenges for the 21st Century

·       Key Challenges To Basic Scientific Understanding:

1.   What is Mind? (how to build/understand intelligence)
·         Intelligence up to the subsymbolic level, ordinary neural nets today
·         Symbolic/semiotic intelligence and beyond
2.   How does the Universe work? (Quantum physics...)
3.   What is Life? (e.g., quantitative systems biotechnology)

·        Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2 - Page 21 Image003

Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2 - Page 21 Image003

Key Broader Challenges to Humanity:

4. Sustainable growth on Earth
·         Global sustainable energy/environment & mid-term survival
·         “yin sustainability,” e.g. population, related women’s issues, peace
5. Cost-effective sustainable space settlement
6. Human potential  -- growth/learning in brain, soul, integration (body)
·          World Religions

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Post n°512

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Mon Jun 30, 2014 9:20 am

Bell's Theorem, Many Worlds and Backwards-Time Physics: Not Just a Matter of Interpretation
Paul J. Werbos

http://arxiv.org/abs/0801.1234

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dan

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Post n°513

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:46 pm

Gary,

Thank you for the link to Paul Werbos.

I agree with his Mega Challenges, with the following significant caveats.......

Here is the better ordering......

4, 6, 1, 2, 3 and forget 5. It ain't gonna happen.

Very likely, there is no such thing as sustainable growth. In fact, without #5, it is an oxymoron! Please see Fermi's Paradox.

Instead of #4, we should be looking for a prosperous way down (PWD)..... http://prosperouswaydown.com/

#6 ....... Unlike you, Gary, Paul acknowledges that we do not live by bread alone. Welcome to the BPWH.

There is much here to discuss.

Back to #SubTel.......

Right away, the author makes a crucial point...... for Aristotle, and, presumably, for the ancients, substance belonged to the living, not to the dead.

Our modern minds can hardly comprehend such a distinction.

(cont.)
------------
I will be in Alaska for the next three weeks. There should be some internet access.

Last edited by dan on Mon Jun 30, 2014 3:01 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post n°514

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by GSB/SSR Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:58 pm

Dan, does Ron qualify for this? ;-)

https://www.cia.gov/contact-cia/report-threats.html

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Post n°515

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Mon Jun 30, 2014 3:29 pm

Gary,

Ron, just by his little lonesome, a threat to national security? I doubt it.

But, as one of the three musketeers, R,A&D, most definitely!

Hey, sports fans, see something.... say something!

Ooops...... I mispoke about Ari. He saw artefacts as substantial.

But what about the Sun, we might ask? Or the (dead) tree that falls on your car?

A volcano or earthquake? Hard to dismiss.

Such events were, presumably, considered to be animated. Animism and vitalism ruled the ancient mind.

Or Samuel J kicking the stone? The stone's substance is quite vicarious.

What is the quintessential object? Mt Everest. Yet, back in the day, inanimate objects existed only in as much as they could be presumed to be possessed. This is no small matter, ontologically speaking.

(cont.)

dan

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Post n°516

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Tue Jul 01, 2014 3:33 pm

July 1 -- enroute to Anchorage

How did I manage to ignore Aristotle, for the last 70 years?

Ari believed in the elements, but not in the atoms. How can we ever recapture that mindset? It is about archetypes, for sure.

Is there a problem with individuals? Particulars? That has to do with the hegemony of spacetime. Or is it space and time?

The quantum attempts to break that hegemony, with limited success.

Woolhouse asks if there is such a thing as an individual substance. Is that not tantamount to denying the individual? Is Ari a monist? Am I?

Leibniz rejected monism, in a big way. What was his problem?

WGL came 50 years after Descartes. It was a tough act to follow. Mind and body? No, mind and space. Space is a tough nut. Hard to crack. Like fighting your way out of a paper bag. Don't fight it. Enjoy it. Enjoy lostness. We have a room of our own, a fortunate few.

To the E2SHI...... they may be wondering why they had been called together. Well, it's not rocket science. Richard C may be a virtual fulcrum.

Yes, he is a pantheist, but too many people take pantheism as an excuse. Is cop-out too crude? Who might have thought that x1 would be an easy act to follow. Much too easy? A sucker-hole? No, just a clown act.

Letting go..... easier said than done. Trust.... ok, but trust what? There's the rub. Instinct, sure, but which ones? Playing off and through. Being one nanosecond in front. Surfing, of course. Not looking at your feet.

And when do I stop being insane? Isn't that crutch getting a bit rusty, worm-eaten? Man-up, smith.

It looks like we're just about to pass over Glacier Bay. At 35k, the glaciers extend almost to the horizon. Just a few peaks sticking up.

dan

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Post n°517

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Thu Jul 03, 2014 11:21 am

We're headed into Denali, for three nights, where we'll have no TV, radio, cell or internet. One satellite phone. Only shuttle buses are allowed. If the world ended, we would be the last to find out. Their landline is in Fairbanks, so they must use carrier-pigeon from there.

Last edited by dan on Thu Jul 03, 2014 11:46 am; edited 1 time in total

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
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Post n°518

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Thu Jul 03, 2014 11:36 am

Dan, maybe the mother ship would make a stop in the Denali and pick you up before proceeding to center stage ... of course, assuming there is a center stage, and also that it would be the real mother ship.

dan

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Post n°519

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Thu Jul 03, 2014 11:51 am

Thanks, Skai, but I'll let you have my spot on the mothership. I'll be waiting for the Princess ship, or is that Holland-America?

It's not getting dark enough to see the usual northern lights, so Ron is calling his friend at HAARP to see if they can't crank up the voltage a bit. We won't have anything else to watch, except for the Russian subs out in the Berring Straits, just over the hill from here.

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Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°520

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Thu Jul 03, 2014 10:30 pm

Sounds exciting, Dan. I'm trying to duck and cover here ... too many people going wild for the 4th.

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°521

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Thu Jul 03, 2014 10:32 pm

Back in the day I played blues harp in some jam sessions w/ local dudes. Too bad they didn't have haarp back then ... wow, I coulda played blues haarp.

dan

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Post n°522

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:18 pm

July 9-- enroute from Anchorage to Juneau and on to Gustavus.

Still working on atomism. Only alternative is Parmenides and monism. I do favor the latter over the former. Time and change are relative to ego consciousness. Is Creation thereby belittled? Well, my monism is primarily a reaction against reductionism. And do KIM that the Monad is love.

Why is the prophetic tradition harnessed to dualism and dichotomy? Creator is infinite, and creation is finite or not. room ii

With theism, Creation has a positive connotation, whereas, with pantheism, creation is negatively connoted.

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°523

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:26 pm

"
With theism, Creation has a positive connotation, whereas, with pantheism, creation is negatively connoted. "

How so?

skaizlimit: Senior Member; Posts : 180
Join date : 2012-09-21

Post n°524

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by skaizlimit Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:28 pm

Also, is there any movement between the two, and if so, in which direction?

dan

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Post n°525

Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

Post by dan Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:53 pm

Skai,

I'm not aware of a definitive answer to your question, nonetheless this is the most common assumption. But we must be cautious, recalling that Genesis depicts human transgression as the source of the very considerable evil in the world, much like the accumulating karma in pantheism.

In the latter, there can only be individual salvation, while the former envisages a divinely ordained collective redemption that will return all of Creation to original glory. Pantheism entails an eternally recurring natural cycle of growth and decay.

I am simply proposing a positive panentheism, with a finite Creation. Why did there have to be such an extreme split between the East and West? I can't see that it makes sense, other than as a setup for the grand finale...... D-day, when we have the reconciliation of all the traditions, including science.

A simple historical fact is the great prevalence of Taboo. The divine is treated with trepidation in all traditions. Yes, there is the numinous, the mysterium tremendum, the uncanny, the wholly Other. Some of that may be experienced in certain types of nightmares. Some abduction experiences contain such fear.

Christians pray for the Lord to hurry, but who among us is in a big hurry to meet their Maker?

(cont.)

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Re: Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

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