Hello, Cy, OMF II - Part 2

First topic message reminder :

2:40pm EST

White Smoke 30 min ago.... Watching it live... awaiting the New Pope to walk out on the balcony. Vatican Guards and Italian Naval Soldiers marching on the steps of St.Peters Basilica, to the music of the Marching Band.




--------------------------

edit notice: This thread is the Part Two continuation from the original thread - last post here -

https://openmindsforum.forumotion.com/t6p990-hello-cy-hello-omf-ii#2215

Hi Dan,
Before I respond to our chat here, I wanted to point out that this plug here below is rather disturbing.  I hope you would consider editing it out of your post.
 

dan wrote:....

Their S. African drone safari went well, and the WCUAVC may be just in time to save the Rhino in the Kruger park...... http://www.wcuavc.com/ .  1,000/7,000 remaining rhinos have been poached this year.  Impoverished Mozambique youths can earn $100's for a single night's foray into the Kruger.  Persistent deadly force is the only short-term fix.  
>
Tomorrow LotP will broadcast on WolfSpirit radio at the usual time.  It will be a review of their S. African trip.  

 
 
The planning, outfitting and orchestrating of Child Assassination is against the laws of the most countries, the Geneva Convention and the country that hosts the server of this forum, last I understood.
 
I'm not sure about Mozambique.  I know it is general knowledge that Gov't authorized child assassination is tolerated without penalty by Police and Military authorities in the Congo.  If it is also permitted in Mozambique then I guess I have no say in passing judgment in that regard.
 
But I am concerned that you may be violating certain laws with respect to our Countries (US and Canada) in promoting these types of corporate organizational plans and mission statements.  I also see that you are publishing the corporate website which includes pictures and names of the directors of this organization.  By doing so you may be putting them in grave danger in the advent that any Mozambique family should want to seek revenge against the murder of one of their children.
 
Please reconsider what you are promoting and posting here, and edit your posts accordingly. 

On a personal note, while I am deeply saddened by the potential extinction of Rhinoceros, assassination of innocent children who are near starving to death, can not be the correct humanitarian approach.
 
I did see the word "Education" being used in that website.  I would have hoped that Humans would wish to lean toward investing and developing Education Initiatives as a deterrent to animal poaching, rather than by Assassination by some Military Grunt sitting at a desk with a joy stick and trigger.
 
But then, it's entirely obvious this has nothing to do with saving Rhinos.  It's all about profit, power, control and manipulation of Africa.
 
Now, I do understand that the African jungle bunnies need a different form of management in order to eventually become a functioning civilization.  But there are much better ways than by Drones operated by cold-blooded murderers, with smiling faces eating popcorn.
 
 
 
 
There, now that feels better to get that off my chest.  I've been quite disturbed since yesterday over your cold posting, dished up as if it be a charitable humanitarian work.

MD02 wrote:

Jake Reason wrote:
 
I felt John's closing comment to be the most insightful of the two regarding the entire UFO Subject and our earthly approach to it.... he said, "I don't think we are asking the right questions."
 

Mirror comment ATS

Interesting, thanks MD.

I'm sure you caught the date the blogging began....curiousness?

Didn't most everyone believe JA was the darkest of birds? Changing public feathers? Green Berets/Red Berets live right down a firebrake or two, unless that has changed over the passage of time.

Still, I'll watch.... Through the ads of course....

RP2STICKS: GRINNING

Spelling edit.

Jake,

Your points are well taken, and I will bring them up with the management of Al Kareem.  

You must also understand that there is a great frustration with the total disregard wrt the impending extinction of one of the last remaining of the wild megafauna.  

It is known to us that the Gates foundation has contributed > $100 million to the WWF.  Eliminating the S. Korean market is a step in the right direction.  Going after China and Vietnam will take many more years.  These are years that the Rhinos do not have.  

Is a human life worth less than the life of a Rhino?  What would a Christian or a Muslim say about that?  In many parts of the world, human lives are virtually worthless, on the open market.  This is the end product of millennia of spiritual disregard for the evident evils of excess procreation.  

Nonetheless, no child or Rhino is born without a reason, and we are about to discover the respective reasons.  That is my job, Jake, and sometimes you are less than helpful, in that regard.  


I now need to prepare for a meet-up with Craig, later today.  This entails my continued review of his 'Simplicity'.  Our telling point of difference lies in his deliberate rejection of Leibniz' II.  This is what I now investigate.........

The reason for our difference wrt the II, lies in our divergent takes on the 'episteme'.  Craig takes a narrow, historical view of the episteme.  I take the most generous, cosmic/eternal, unbounded view of the episteme, wherein, on any idealist PoV, there can be no distinction between the Episteme, the Ontos and the Logos, all of which is covered by the Agapos and the Apokatastasis.  

Yes, I am a radical monist/holist.  All else is smoke and mirrors.  How then may we assign value to human lives?  Well, it starts with the reciprocity between the micro- and macro- cosms.  Ultimately there can be no distinction.  Every one of us contains the Monad, in its entirety.  

What about the rhinos and the stinkbugs?  What do they contain?  Each contains the entire ecosystem, sans humanity.  Therein are they, individually, radically less real than are you or me. You and I have absolute potential. Such is not the case with our feathered friends. What potential they may have is predicated upon us.




(cont.)

Jake Reason wrote:Hi Dan,
Before I respond to our chat here, I wanted to point out that this plug here below is rather disturbing.  I hope you would consider editing it out of your post.
 

dan wrote:....

Their S. African drone safari went well, and the WCUAVC may be just in time to save the Rhino in the Kruger park...... http://www.wcuavc.com/ .  1,000/7,000 remaining rhinos have been poached this year.  Impoverished Mozambique youths can earn $100's for a single night's foray into the Kruger.  Persistent deadly force is the only short-term fix.  
>
Tomorrow LotP will broadcast on WolfSpirit radio at the usual time.  It will be a review of their S. African trip.  

 
 
The planning, outfitting and orchestrating of Child Assassination is against the laws of the most countries, the Geneva Convention and the country that hosts the server of this forum, last I understood.
 
I'm not sure about Mozambique.  I know it is general knowledge that Gov't authorized child assassination is tolerated without penalty by Police and Military authorities in the Congo.  If it is also permitted in Mozambique then I guess I have no say in passing judgment in that regard.
 
But I am concerned that you may be violating certain laws with respect to our Countries (US and Canada) in promoting these types of corporate organizational plans and mission statements.  I also see that you are publishing the corporate website which includes pictures and names of the directors of this organization.  By doing so you may be putting them in grave danger in the advent that any Mozambique family should want to seek revenge against the murder of one of their children.
 
Please reconsider what you are promoting and posting here, and edit your posts accordingly. 

On a personal note, while I am deeply saddened by the potential extinction of Rhinoceros, assassination of innocent children who are near starving to death, can not be the correct humanitarian approach.
 
I did see the word "Education" being used in that website.  I would have hoped that Humans would wish to lean toward investing and developing Education Initiatives as a deterrent to animal poaching, rather than by Assassination by some Military Grunt sitting at a desk with a joy stick and trigger.
 
But then, it's entirely obvious this has nothing to do with saving Rhinos.  It's all about profit, power, control and manipulation of Africa.
 
Now, I do understand that the African jungle bunnies need a different form of management in order to eventually become a functioning civilization.  But there are much better ways than by Drones operated by cold-blooded murderers, with smiling faces eating popcorn.
 

- End rant -

 
 
 
There, now that feels better to get that off my chest.  I've been quite disturbed since yesterday over your cold posting, dished up as if it be a charitable humanitarian work.

Thank you for taking the lead on this Jake.  I was wondering if I was the only person who had noticed.

There is even more to this than you pointed out.  We in the patriot movement know that things like this are beta testing.  The system lords use corporations to do their dirty work beta testing certain things to establish common precedence and a "reasonable" excuse...i.e. rhino preservation.

It is a prime example of their devaluation of life.  We already know that the System is using targeted assassination of humans using drones in the Afgan & neighboring region/nation Pakistan.

Obama has claimed the right to kill American's at will overseas without warrant, court or conviction...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/9913615/Barack-Obama-has-authority-to-use-drone-strikes-to-kill-Americans-on-US-soil.html

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/10/22/1249581/-Living-in-a-Drone-Laboratory

These matters on the heels of threats here at home to "yard-farm" our communities of undesirables and their families come a martial law circumstance, reported to us by family members within military circles.

There is much more here that is problematic than even our personal issue with it being inappropriate for our respective nations and servers.

We within the liberty movement suffer being touted as extremists because we have protested this conduct in the past and continue to protest this ideology that mankind are vermin and a plague upon the Earth to be exterminated at will and spoken of with all disrespect regardless of circumstance for politics having a higher value than individual and collective rights.

Hear well the related silence of the genocide occurring overseas by our System's sanctioned "rebels" who pull Christians from their homes and expel, murder, and commit mayhem that whole nations may be destabilized for the benefit of high placed white collar criminals poised to benefit in diametrically opposed nations.  

The NDAA is in this same family of activities that designates citizens as potential enemy combatants and enables the use of rendition.

But these things are unstoppable when government does it.  And as we all know excrement rolls downhill and others join the fray following suit....

Which is the Pandolfi effort?  Is it beta-testing for eventual yard-farming in America, Canada, and Mexico?  Or is it just little guys following suit...if it is ok for Obama and Company to use drones to assassinate in Pakistan and Afganistan, then surely there is no legal issue for them to do it in Mozambique!  After all human life is over-populated according to them and of less value than earthworm fodder which of course they intend to manufacture with scientific reason-ability, just ask Dan's buddy John. 

But the Princess is such a sweet person with a tremendous destiny says Dan and Ron.  Cough Cough.  

Fine words butter no parsnips.


But thank you Jake.  Spot on.

Cy


Edit to add on this one:  I'm not just yelling foul...I'm yelling crimes against humanity.  Its a huge organization that makes the Nazis look like an easter parade....but oh wait!  if you look deep enough you will indeed find the descendants of the Nazi International...in bed with Fabian Socialists.  From the Bell to Eisenhower's warning, to the DUMBs, repeated attempts at thefts of on base nukes, to depopulation theory/population stabilization, to the development and use of drones to conduct warfare, to full redistribution of wealth, to yard-farming/gun control/confiscation and ultimate eradication of all constitutional restrictions.  From control of education to control of media to control of monetary and foreign policy to build a controlled global governance not by the People of the World or For the People of the World.

Yes huge indeed.

Jake and Cy,

It would seem that you are advocating the assassination of certain individuals associated with Al Kareem, which number might well include myself.

Deadly force is tolerated in instances of self-defense. If we have one poacher targetting the last Rhino pair, would it not be advisable to target that poacher, in the face of such an irredeemable loss?

Self-sanctification wrt such fraught issues is suspect, to say the least.

As to the US's role wrt to maintaining global security and targeting mass murderers in the pursuit thereof, it is not a matter that lends itself well to ideological grandstanding.

Nonetheless, I will defend your right to espouse silly ideas.



(cont.)

dan wrote:Jake and Cy,

It would seem that you are advocating the assassination of certain individuals associated with Al Kareem, which number might well include myself.  

That's just plain silly, Dan.  Such is unthinkable for me.  But its not for many people, Especially in that part of the world.  Your posting of the primary use of the Drones was irresponsible, plain and simple.  And dangerous too! - thus why I pointed this out.  The organization has obviously and with purpose, specifically chosen NOT to explain how the drones would be used.
 
Publish that the drones will alert Forest Rangers.  Or use tranquilizer darts, or carry a loud speaker warning them to cease and desist.  But blatantly stating they will use deadly force as there is no other option.  And informing that the targets are most likely to be impoverished children!?
 
Get ahold of yourself!
 

Deadly force is tolerated in instances of self-defense.  If we have one poacher targeting the last Rhino pair, would it not be advisable to target that poacher, in the face of such an irredeemable loss?  

Doesn't this question need to specify who that person is?  What if were Aliyah gunning down the rhino to save her child from being stampeded?
 
That's enough for this post.  Now I'll return to your original reply to this issue.
 
Thank you Cy
 
 
 
.

dan wrote:Jake and Cy,

It would seem that you are advocating the assassination of certain individuals associated with Al Kareem, which number might well include myself.  

Deadly force is tolerated in instances of self-defense.  If we have one poacher targetting the last Rhino pair, would it not be advisable to target that poacher, in the face of such an irredeemable loss?  

Self-sanctification wrt such fraught issues is suspect, to say the least.  

As to the US's role wrt to maintaining global security and targeting mass murderers in the pursuit thereof, it is not a matter that lends itself well to ideological grandstanding.  

Nonetheless, I will defend your right to espouse silly ideas.  



(cont.)  

Wholly incorrect Dan.  Reread what I wrote.  We accused you and the Pandolfi family/company of advocating assassination and violation of international laws.

Cy wrote:Edit to add on this one:  

I'm not just yelling foul...I'm yelling crimes against humanity.  

Its a huge organization that makes the Nazis look like an easter parade....but oh wait!  if you look deep enough you will indeed find the descendants of the Nazi International...in bed with Fabian Socialists.  

From the Bell to Eisenhower's warning, to the DUMBs, repeated attempts at thefts of on base nukes, to depopulation theory/population stabilization, to the development and use of drones to conduct warfare, to full redistribution of wealth, to yard-farming/gun control/confiscation and ultimate eradication of all constitutional restrictions.  From control of education to control of media to control of monetary and foreign policy to build a controlled global governance not by the People of the World or For the People of the World.

Yes huge indeed.

*

I spoke with someone recently who was asked by someone else what was his occupation in the mil.  His answer was effectively none - meaning unacknowledged.  He reiterated what I had heard from a half dozen other sources, that before this is all said and done "they" meaning the ones at the top of the dung heap calling the shots fully intend to create and set in motion an event so globally huge as to dwarf all other horrific acts.

This Jake and I have pointed out is just the tip of the iceberg in other words.  But where does one begin in tracking the beast and its hydratic tendrils if you are a layman?

Salute!

Cy

cc. Elias Alias OathKeepers

dan wrote:Jake,

Your points are well taken, and I will bring them up with the management of Al Kareem.  

Thank you. Hopefully you'll receive a reprimand. Even 10k sponsors can make mistakes. And this one was a doozy.

(Sponser info published on the website.)

You must also understand that there is a great frustration with the total disregard wrt the impending extinction of one of the last remaining of the wild megafauna.  

I most certainly do understand.

It is known to us that the Gates foundation has contributed > $100 million to the WWF.  Eliminating the S. Korean market is a step in the right direction.  Going after China and Vietnam will take many more years.  These are years that the Rhinos do not have.

Yes, I mentioned these in my follow-on post. You must have read it before I deleted it after I realized a continued rant was redundant.

So yes, "Education" does in fact work. We have proof of it now. The techniques of societal psychological programming is a well developed science. And one of the men who was responsible for the S.Korea success believes they can do the same for Vietnam.

My point - there are Educational options. And they are also more persuasive and targeted non-lethal options, but that is another subject all together. Interesting that John Alexander oddly came up during conversation. I hadn't expect we would be talking about child assassination by aerial drones.

Is a human life worth less than the life of a Rhino?  What would a Christian or a Muslim say about that?  In many parts of the world, human lives are virtually worthless, on the open market.  This is the end product of millennia of spiritual disregard for the evident evils of excess procreation.  

Yes, I too have spent many hours over this human saga. You're absolutely right about "worthless". I saw it in Morocco.

Which leads me to say - I don't know what a Muslim would say. I guess it depends upon which one. I have read satanic verses in their Koran that teach the beheading of non-believers merely for not believing. And it is considered the rule of Allah - Divine Law to many Muslims.

As a Christian however, I know that true Christians can not endorse such behavior. Christian scripture teaches the methods of thinking and education to teach and lead people toward increasing their moral awareness and responsibility to humanity and nature.

A Christian would say no lethal force should be used, regardless of any circumstance. Once that was an accepted policy, the minds involved in dealing with the matter would automatically create and develop non-lethal tactics that would be equally as effective (and even better in the long run), than stopping the act of poaching through deadly force.

Nonetheless, no child or Rhino is born without a reason, and we are about to discover the respective reasons.  That is my job, Jake, and sometimes you are less than helpful, in that regard.  

I am only saying what millions of others will also say, if they find out. And Heck, many wouldn't be near as kind as I am about it.

Just ask Bill Gates.

Jake wrote:I am only saying what millions of others will also say, if they find out. And Heck, many wouldn't be near as kind as I am about it.

Just ask Bill Gates.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/matthewherper/2011/11/02/the-second-coming-of-bill-gates/



http://21stcenturywire.com/2013/03/06/bill-gates-and-polio-new-vaccines-can-help-reduce-population-by-10-15/



Bill Gates' Polio Vaccine Program Caused 47500 Cases of Paralysis
nsnbc.me/.../bill-gates-polio-vaccine-program-caused-47500-cases-of-pa...‎

May 8, 2013 - Bill Gates' Polio Vaccine Program Caused 47500 Cases of Paralysis Death. In India, Monsanto hired Bollywood actors to promote genetically ..

Is a human life worth a Rhino?  David Gladstone says yes.

Cyrellys  <........>	Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 11:37 AM
To: David Gladstone <..........>
Cc: list
Then you might take a closer look at an October earthquake off the Carolina coast. But hey there is no relation between how information and ideas flow to how they get used.  You believe drone use to protect elephants and rhinos in Africa is all on the up and up....can I sell you a stretch of beach front property in Arizona? Considering what I've been learning under the table those statements you protest are indeed warranted. * Here is another thing to consider... When shtf whether it is due to engineered economic collapse or a vaporization of several cities, and this nation does not produce its own food, so in the crisis when the 13.5 and 4 oz cans run out and the population turns the land to sustain itself just a hair longer, the people might find the tables turned on them.   Those deer and elk everyone likes to say they will just hunt to feed their starving children will suddenly be classified same as the elephant and rhino. And drones will hunt you and yours when you attempt to feed yourself... ...that is assuming you don't take the FEMA guillotine option. What you do today shall revisit you tomorrow.  Choose wisely. Cy On 12/4/13, David Gladstone <.......> wrote: > "Makes Nazis look like an Easter Parade?" > > This remark is ignorant and quite inexcusable, IMO. People use no judgment > and make hysterical hyperbolic statements that mean nothing but raise the > noise level a great deal! > > I agree with Dan! > > Sent from my iPhone

Jake and Cy,

I do thank you for these clarifications.  

The fact remains that I am a more stringent idealist than any others that can be found on the internet.  Perhaps that makes me more cognizant of the gap between the present reality and the anticipated human fulfilment of its potentiality.  

Probably by design, Ron and Aliyah remain my best and perhaps my only conduit to a timely Disclosure wrt the BPWH.  Does this create a bias wrt to the ethical ramifications of rhino conservation?  Of course it does.  

Is ethical compromise a bad thing wrt saving the world?  Do the ends sometimes justify the means?  Is not Christianity founded upon the notion of Felix Culpa?  Of course it is.  

Yes, we were intended to receive the Disturbing Message.  Should the PtB not have been so informed?  Who amongst us is without sin?  Pretending otherwise is the royal road to every kind of insanity and absurdity.  

Such issues are not to be solved on technicalities.  Whether or not a particular drone is armed and with what hardly matters when the end result is the death of a poacher, regardless of his age.  We all bear guilt in whatever happens to the least of the seven billion of us.  We all bear responsibility for the stewardship of God's Creation. To suppose otherwise is the only unforgivable sin, because it is a sin against the Truth.   We are our brothers' keepers, be they a neglected child in Africa or the Chairman of the Board of Haliburton.  

Lethal force will never triumph.  Only love.  Projecting hatred against anyone will only prolong the agony.  There are many who embrace agony.  In befriending R&A, do I embrace every evil of the PtB?  That is quite a stretch.  I forgive them.  They forgive me.  That is all that will matter, in the end.  

Every breath we take is a compromise.  To not be so compromised is to be dead.  If we can't stand the heat, we had best vacate the kitchen.  

BTW, I do continue to labor under the impression that Ron had prior knowledge of 9/11.  Can you see no mitigation for inaction?  I can, rather easily, if truth be known.  But, hey, that's just me.  



(cont.)

dan wrote:Jake,

I do thank you for these clarifications.  

The fact remains that I am a more stringent idealist than any others that can be found on the internet.  Perhaps that makes me more cognizant of the gap between the present reality and the anticipated human fulfilment of its potentiality.  

Probably by design, Ron and Aliyah remain my best and perhaps my only conduit to a timely Disclosure wrt the BPWH.  Does this create a bias wrt to the ethical ramifications of rhino conservation?  Of course it does.  

Is ethical compromise a bad thing wrt svaing the world?  Do the ends sometimes justify the means?  Is not Christianity founded upon the notion of Felix Culpa?  Of course it is.  

Yes, we were intended to receive the Disturbing Message.  Should the PtB not have been so informed?  Who amongst us is without sin?  Pretending otherwise is the royal road to every kind of insanity and absurdity.  

Such issues are not to be solved on technicalities.  Whether or not a particular drone is armed and with what hardly matters when the end result is the death of a poacher, regardless of his age.  We all bear guilt in what ever happens to the least of the seven billion of us.  To suppose otherwise is the only unforgivable sin, because it is a sin against the Truth.   We are our brothers' keepers, be they a neglected child in Africa or the Chairman of the Board of Haliburton.  

Lethal force will never triumph.  Only love.  Projecting hatred against anyone will only prolong the agony.  There are many who embrace agony.  In befriending R&A, do I embrace every evil of the PtB?  That is quite a stretch.  I forgive them.  They forgive me.  That is all that will matter, in the end.  

Every breath we take is a compromise.  To not be so compromised is to be dead.  If we can't stand the heat, we had best vacate the kitchen.  

BTW, I do continue to labor under the impression that Ron had prior knowledge of 9/11.  Can you see no mitigation for inaction?  I can, rather easily, if truth be known.  But, hey, that's just me.  



(cont.)

Good grief Dan!  you speak about only love triumphing and then compromise and the use of lethal force in the same breath.

Yeah Haliburton and neglected children in Africa are on the same par when it comes to being monsters....You are of course remembering who did the construction on the camps here in the US for everyone?  

You talk as if the sacrifice is worthy.  Would you do the same?  Would you and all your generation volunteer to stand peacefully in line at the guillotines to benefit a few ugly-minded elites?  

My dear that is not fulfilling man's potential not in either option!  

Now Jakes suggestion of other options is the right track.  

on a parallel note...this next piece of info serves to illustrate just how late we are in the narrative of our current course - you can see it if you can come to understand that Obamacare is just the current poster child for what is wrong in this nation:

Top10NewsToday wrote:


Published on Dec 3, 2013
During a congressional committee hearing about the constitutional limits imposed on the presidency and the implications of President Barack Obama's disregard for implementing the Affordable Care Act as written, one expert testified that the consequences of the president's behavior were potentially grave. He said that the precedent set by Obama could eventually lead to an armed revolt against the federal government.

On Tuesday, Michael Cannon, Cato Institute's Director of Health Policy Studies, testified before a congressional committee about the dangers of the president's legal behavior.

"There is one last thing to which the people can resort if the government does not respect the restrains that the constitution places on the government," Cannon said. "Abraham Lincoln talked about our right to alter our government or our revolutionary right to overthrow it."

RELATED: NY Times Buries The Lede: Anderson Cooper's Ratings Surge At 8PM

"That is certainly something that no one wants to contemplate," he continued. "If the people come to believe that the government is no longer constrained by the laws then they will conclude that neither are they."

"That is a very dangerous sort of thing for the president to do, to wantonly ignore the laws," Cannon concluded, "to try to impose obligation upon people that the legislature did not approve.

"That is certainly something that no one wants to contemplate," he continued. "If the people come to believe that the government is no longer constrained by the laws then they will conclude that neither are they."

didn't I just say something to that effect a few posts back?  Cy

David Gladstone <........> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 12:22 PM
To: Cyrellys <.........>

I didn't say that you are putting words in my mouth. I am against using drones as Amazon and law enforcement want. I can imagine a sky full of drones of all sizes; surveilling people, looking for parole violators or deadbeats, maybe traffic violators. I would want to invest in a company that makes anti drone technologies. But as far as the animals go, they deserve and need our protection. If we as stewards if this planet cannot protect some of the remaining wildlife on this planet we may have to answer for or one day.

Sent from my iPhone

Cyrellys <.......> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 12:56 PM
To: David Gladstone <......>

I agree with you on those points. But I am trying to communicate
there is something bigger here among this desire to "protect" the
remaining wildlife. You know, I hear so often people say how was it
the Teaparty failed; how did it get conscripted from within and then
turned around and used against everyone to help Obama succeed to the
presidency, etc, etc, etc....

Well here is how it was done. Different subject and venue, same technique.

When all this results in mankind being outlawed (an extreme example)
and drones hunting people, as they already are but worse,
everywhere.....and the people moan asking how did this
happen...someone please remember I pointed it out. Maybe humanity 2.0
will do better than we did and actually get living right.

Gasp! she used the term humanity 2.0; is she transhumanist? no. But
everything we're dismissing now is ensuring the transhumanists win and
humanity 1.0 loses. Wait you say, that's not what I want to
happen...you say, I want us all to survive, become better people by
protecting things like the wild creatures and the earth, alongside all
the ideals. I know. But how else do I warn that the way we are going
about this is stripping the intended result from us. My job to speak
truth to all forms of power.

JakeReason did say there were other better options. I happen to agree.

David Gladstone <...............> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 1:03 PM
To: Cyrellys <...........>

Then you are failing. There are always bigger issues at stake and that's the first thing people say who want to impose their own agenda. I say we do this for the parks all around the world where poaching is a problem but if we do it may lead to great abuses and other bad things. These things will happen anyway but at least one good thing might come of it, rather than nothing.
Better cut this list it's way too large and many want out.

Sent from my iPhone

Cyrellys <.......> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 1:20 PM
To: David Gladstone <........>

nice circumvention. I can see the ends justifies the means with you.
So you would stoop to megalomania and pathological murder to achieve
the end rather than explore and build alternatives.


***********


I rest my case.

"That is certainly something that no one wants to contemplate," he continued. "If the people come to believe that the government is no longer constrained by the laws then they will conclude that neither are they."

"....one expert testified that the consequences of the president's behavior were potentially grave. He said that the precedent set by Obama could eventually lead to an armed revolt against the federal government."

Surely Jake remembers the warnings I gave in 2008 about armed revolt due to unethical, corrupt behavior...wrong choices regardless if the intent was good or not.

The litmus test still reads positive for the strand. We have not yet escaped Armageddon.

Cy

David Gladstone <.........> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 1:36 PM
To: Cyrellys <.........>

It's not my agenda but I would prefer to get one good thing out of what will happen anyway. Posing a scenario as if there are alternatives when there aren't is a bit dishonest, wouldn't you say?

When it comes to a planet where hundreds of thousands die each day or whatever the number is, I'm not going to overly worry about poachers or child molesters or war criminals or even Congress, for that matter, if someone takes some of these out. They will all be replaced, no doubt, humans being what they are.

Sent from my iPhone


Cyrellys <.......> Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 2:11 PM
To: David Gladstone <.....>

I suppose then there lies the difference between you and I. I won't
compromise on any of those things. I believe in a world worthy of
living in. I believe in human potential to achieve that and more. I
won't sell my soul to settle for half measures. I wasn't built for
that.

And there are alternatives, but if you don't focus on them and spend
time with those who have or know of them, then how can you say there
are none? Are you seeking you're own gilded cage because it is easier
to shoot, kill, and intimidate, than to solve problems equitably for
all involved so the problem evaporates rather than continues in nooks
and crannies?

You said, "...hundreds of thousands die each day or whatever the
number is, I'm not going to overly worry about poachers or child
molesters or war criminals or even Congress, for that matter, if
someone takes some of these out. They will all be replaced, no doubt,
humans being what they are."

QUOTE:

A Thousand voices keen at night
A Thousand voices wail,
A Thousand voices cry in fright
A Thousand voices fail

You followed them, young healer lass
till they could not be seen;
A Thousand dragons made their loss
A bridge 'tween you and me.


Seek the alternatives David...change the future. Cyrellys

Cy,

I think I see what the problem is between us, here, wrt technology assisted counter-poaching (TACP). You are looking at it from an institutional perspective, whereas I am looking at it from a personal perspective.

Yes, I can see that, from your pespective, even the peripheral involvement of the CIA is highly problematic. On the ground, however, I would rather have the agency protecting rhinos than doing a lot of other things.

Is Ron being deliberately provocative? I wouldn't put it past him, but he does have a long and passionate involvement with protecting wildlife. That the agency might get some favorable publicity is not evil in itself.

You see the provocation as central. I see it as peripheral. I can sympathize with that.

dan wrote:Cy,

I think I see what the problem is between us, here, wrt technology assisted counter-poaching (TACP).  You are looking at it from an institutional perspective, whereas I am looking at it from a personal perspective.  

Yes, I can see that, from your pespective, even the peripheral involvement of the CIA is highly problematic.  On the ground, however, I would rather have the agency protecting rhinos than doing a lot of other things.  

Is Ron being deliberately provocative?  I wouldn't put it past him, but he does have a long and passionate involvement with protecting wildlife.  That the agency might get some favorable publicity is not evil in itself.  

You see the provocation as central.  I see it as peripheral.  I can sympathize with that.  

Sigh.  Dan, I think you're missing the boat again.  I think you're ignorant of how societal engineering is done using global resources to achieve wholesale alterations here at home.  I think you are being used my friend.  Your innocence is being exploited to achieve a socio-political success to justify establishing them in a fully developed weaponized capacity here at home and probably in other nations for use the next step up from targeted assassination.  

But you will carry on because in all the years I've watched you operate you are rarely swayed by reason or truth.

I'm sorry Dan but the Pandolfi's are criminals.  They're little project violates international law, is a crime against humanity in the making, is just plain murderous and is part of a series of projects that will eventually culminate in the final destruction of the nation in which you live which will include yard-farming here using the contraptions.  And you will have helped to facilitate the coming holocaust by establishing ability, feasibility, and experience doing so under cover of primitive nations and seemingly good causes, "protecting endangered species".

That is about as far from being like Jesus and fulfilling human potential as a human being can get.  Its downright barbaric.

Cy

From: Dan Smith
Date: December 5, 2013, 11:34:31 AM EST
To:  Dick Farley
Cc: .......
Subject: Re: Dan, you and Ron are globally famouser & famouser! Also: Nawaz drones on?

Dick,

I thank you for these thoughtful words.  And, yes, there is always the concern of political correctness, at home and abroad.  

Nonetheless, and of course, international criminal syndicates involve themselves in international trafficking of all kinds… weapons, humans, animal parts, drugs, etc.  

In case you hadn't realized it, the CIA is duly authorized to interdict such international criminal activity.  You should be glad, and so should every humanitarian and conservationist organization.  TBMK, they welcome this assistance.  Where would they be without this assistance?  That is like asking where would the municipal police be without the backing of the FBI.  If the CIA did not contravene international trafficking, they would be legally derelict.  

The fact that many nationals mistrust foreigners is simply a given.  The fact is that US GO's and NGO's are better trusted than are those of most other nations, and for good reason.  No?  

Are you suggesting the the CIA should neglect its duly authorized international responsibilities in order to make international travel by US citizens safer?  Is this not singularly counter-intuitive?  

If you actually wish to protect endangered species, there need to be boots on the ground and eyes in the skies.  As reported to me, there were no other such initiatives present in the Kruger Park during the visit by the Al Kareem Foundation.  Do the rhinos prefer the WWF over Al Kareem?  The WWF was running anti-poaching ads on S. Korean TV.  I applaud that effort, as well.  

Dan

cc OMF

Cy,

You say that Ron and the Princess are committing crimes.  Perhaps you should notify the proper authorities.  

It is true that assassinations are carried out by the global intelligence community on a fairly regular basis, and, just by definition, such activity is in contravention of local jurisdictions.  

The POTUS is legally responsible to oversee such activities, which are carried out on behalf of the Commander-in-Chief.  The President is also the duly elected first-officer of the land, when I last checked.  

These are Constitutional matters.  No?  

No doubt, you believe that the President is being derelict in his duty.  That could rise to the level of criminal neglect, an impeachable offense.  I'm sure the T-party would be glad to add that to their growing roster of official articles of impeachment.  

Is Ron personally operating outside of that legal authority?  He might be.  If he actually were, I don't understand, though, why he would abet the discussion of such activity on an open forum.  Do you?  

Oh, ok, this is just part of the FEMA acclimation project, in preparation for Disclosure.  Hey, that could be.  

Would we prefer that the PtB be prepared or unprepared for Disclosure?  For instance, if you were God, and you had a Disturbing Message to deliver to humanity, would you, perhaps, consider providing some portion of humanity with an advanced notice, a heads-up for those who might have a legitimate need to know, such as certain intelligence officers and, perhaps, the POTUS.  

Might Ron be numbered amongst said officers?  Would you prefer someone else in his stead?  



(cont.)

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-----------------------------------
 
Hi Dan,
 
With regards to your publishing of information that was not required to be shared on this forum, and my request that you edit your posts accordingly in respect of such, I have contacted the Admins of this forum to discuss our obligations under the "Terms of Service" of forumotion.com above.
 
Just in case you may have had a recent stroke or are under the influence of medication or otherwise, and are therefore not fully cognizant of the implications to what you are posting and promoting on this forum at this time;.....
 
FYI as a reminder, there are significant differences between; politically correct, personal opinion, and National and International Law.
 
Further please understand that we can not with certainty project what 'forumotion' may do at any time, without notice or warning.
 
 
 
.

Jake,  

I thank you for exercising your (due?) diligence, in these regards.  

And, yes, I for one, do not wish to contravene any duly established international authority.  I trust that you will keep us, all, apprised of such alleged infractions.  

To wit, it would be helpful, would it not, for you to apprise us of the specific content of your complaint to Forumotion. Or have you determined that the rest of us do not have a need to know such specifics?

dan wrote:Jake,  

I thank you for exercising your (due?) diligence, in these regards.  

Just concerned we don't have another catastrophe.  
 

And, yes, I for one, do not wish to contravene any duly established international authority.  I trust that you will keep us, all, apprised of such alleged infractions.  

I am not engaged in keeping track of established international authority, Dan.  I posted on the previous pages that I don't know about the laws of African nations, and that I am not certain of the laws Canada and USA or the jurisdiction of the server of this forum.
 
However I do know that many countries do not permit certain activities on their lands.  How they apply that to other lands does not fall within my specific knowledge.  I am under the impression however, that what you are endorsing and promoting here, would be a felony if carried out in the USA or Canada.
 

To wit, it would be helpful, would it not, for you to apprise us of your complaint to Forumotion.  No?  

I have not contacted forumotion, nor issued a complaint.  I have emailed this forum's admins (Pman35 and Cyrellys) to discuss our obligations, potential damages and recommendations.
 
You're welcome.  I'm working to protect your hide and ours.
 
You do want this blog/board of yours to continue, don't you?
 
.

Jake,

I do thank you for this timely clarification.  I am also sympathetic with your desire to have some private communications wrt your concerns.  

Going forward, I trust that those attending to this forum are responsible individuals who want to be kept informed about matters that should be of concern to the general public.  That is what forums are for, I believe.  

From your above post.....

However I do know that many countries do not permit certain activities on their lands.  How they apply that to other lands does not fall within my specific knowledge.  I am under the impression however, that what you are endorsing and promoting here, would be a felony if carried out in the USA or Canada.

 
Certainly, the CIA is very restricted in what activities they may engage, domestically.  As a for instance, Ron has apprised me that, in the past, some of his interactions with me, as a citizen, on US soil, have been specifically authorized by the FBI.  You, Jake, would not be so protected, being the citizen of another country.  

As I have stated above, assassinations are, by definition, a contravention of local jurisdiction.  Do I promote such activity?  

Al Kareem and specifically their WCUAVC... http://www.wcuavc.com/ is intended to provide TACP, technology assissted counter-poaching, now and in the future, within various national jurisdictions.  I do promote their conservation activities, which may, conceivably, contribute to the deaths of some poachers.  

It is my understanding that the activities of Al Kareem and the Princess, in the Kruger National Park, were being closely monitored by the local gendarmerie and by the S. African armed forces.  In such situations, I doubt that your concerns would be disregarded.  

However, the situation is liable to become rather more 'complex' when the Princess turns her attention to the protection of the snow leopards in the Ladakh region of Kashmir, her native territory.  

As a putative Princess of Kashmir, she is promoting the self-rule of Kashmir, in contravention of the variously disputed jurisdictional counter-claims being made by the Chinese, Indian and Pakistani military forces of occupation.  

As the Al Kareem operations are migrated to the Ladakh, there will indeed arise questions of authorization.  Just one such issue will be the proclamation of Kashmir to be a nuclear-free zone.  Will the global intelligence community not be involving itself in such matters as may or may not overlap with the protection of the native leopards?  It would be hard to imagine otherwise.  

Should the POTUS disallow the Princess, as a US citizen, from traveling to Kashmir to engage in activities that might actually be intended to lead to an international incident, involving, possibly, the deaths of one or more individuals?  

This is an eventuality worthy of some discussion, I would imagine.


5:20--------

I had the opportunity, last evening, to discuss 'Simplicity' with Craig.  

It could well be the most important philosophical treatise in modern times.  However, in the year since its publication, it has received very little notice.  I suspect that, if it is to be awarded its rightful place in the philosophical cannon, this will come about in the context of the MoAPS in which it ought to figure prominently.  

Craig evinces scant interest in the future of philosophy or of humanity, for that matter.  He shows virtually no evangelical concern, in either regard.  Nor do I recall a mention of any pending work.  

His agnosticism seems firmly in place.  He claims not to be an idealist, rather a perspectivalist.  This view is based on a strong distinction between ontology and epistemology.  Were God to make the scene, he admits that this would occasion a radical shift in his metaphysical views.

My main remaining curiosity would be to guage his reaction to the crucial notion of a CTC.  Having scant acquaintance with GR, he may have no conception of such.  Nonetheless, I want to observe the reaction.  

From my continuing study of the book, I do see that the very notion or possibility of simplicity will inevitably call into question most of the philosophical enterprise since Hegel.  It is the most subversive concept to emerge in the postmodern era.  

I need now to apply it to the aether/logos.  


The closest that Craig gets to the aether is in his treatment of substance as the ground of being.  

Ontologically, the aether would lie between substance and the void.  Substance, on his view, is potentiality.  His notion of space is mainly Newtonian.  

And, for the record, Craig rejects the standard view of relativity in favor of Walther Ritz' emission theory wrt photon propagation. This seems only atavistic to me, and, coming from a young-earther, that is a fairly high bar.  

From: Dan Smith
Date: December 5, 2013, 9:25:47 PM EST
To: Ronald Pandolfi
Cc: Dick Farley, Princess Aliyah
Subject: Re: Lunacy

Ron,

I can post only what I can reasonably infer. If you wish to dispute my inferences, then I invite you to do so.

Nonetheless, I will post your comments, below.


On Dec 5, 2013, at 8:58 PM, Ronald Pandolfi wrote:

Dan,

After reading Farley's odd note, I took a quick look at your blog. Please inform you blog colleagues that your posting are largely fabrications, not reflecting the reality of me, the Princess, or the Wildlife Conservation UAV Challenge. If they have interest in the Wildlife Conservation UAV Challenge, they should read www.wcuavc.com. If they have interest in fabrications, they should continue reading your blog.

V/r
Ron

(cont.)

Hi Dan,
 
 Cyrellys, Pman and I have shared an email conversation.  It is the unanimous among the ADMINS that you have been warned, you understand the concerns, you have had time and dialog to consider.  Since you have not cooperated it is the judgment of the team that "it is time to write up a code of
conduct" and "put a lid on it".
 
We are all friends here, and this sort of action has never happened with the new OMF, so I will try to be as respectful as possible while remaining semi-legally correct in what we feel we have to do to protect the forum and respect the forumotion ToS.
 
On behalf of and with unanimous consent,  I will post an Admin Notice next.  Then a follow-up post with some personal thoughts.
 
 
.